Discussion:
XP1000 power supply?
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Steven Schweda
2017-06-06 16:47:15 UTC
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Today I mourn the power supply in my main XP1000 system
(RIP). My spare/experimental XP1000 (which usually runs
Tru64, when it runs at all) donated its, but now I'm down to
no spares (and no Tru64), so I'm interested in one or two
(low-cost) replacements. Anyone out there with a surplus?

AcBel
API-6108
DIGITAL P/N : 30-48584-01
DATE : A 9911 REV. : A05
CTL No. : A05

I suppose that the real solution would be to migrate
"mainness" to an IA64 system (which, unlike the XP1000
systems, is not yet old enough to vote), but that would be
actual work, and would require setting up an rx26000 in the
basement, where I wouldn't be forced to listen to it most of
the time (more work).
Arne Vajhøj
2017-06-06 18:39:53 UTC
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Post by Steven Schweda
Today I mourn the power supply in my main XP1000 system
(RIP). My spare/experimental XP1000 (which usually runs
Tru64, when it runs at all) donated its, but now I'm down to
no spares (and no Tru64), so I'm interested in one or two
(low-cost) replacements. Anyone out there with a surplus?
AcBel
API-6108
DIGITAL P/N : 30-48584-01
DATE : A 9911 REV. : A05
CTL No. : A05
I suppose that the real solution would be to migrate
"mainness" to an IA64 system (which, unlike the XP1000
systems, is not yet old enough to vote), but that would be
actual work, and would require setting up an rx26000 in the
basement, where I wouldn't be forced to listen to it most of
the time (more work).
What about going emulation?

Arne
Steven Schweda
2017-06-06 20:34:57 UTC
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Post by Arne Vajhøj
What about going emulation?
I did poke at SIMH long enough to get a pseudo-VAX to run
on my main Mac Pro. The only serious problem there was
non-IP networking (discussed here, a while back). If there's
a way to get the emulated network interface to talk directly
to the real Ethernet, then I failed to find it. DECnet-Plus
over IP does work nicely, and more easily than I ever
expected, but it's not everything.

Perhaps I could use reverse Telnet (or someting) to deal
with my (90TL) terminal servers, but SET HOST /DTE is old,
familiar, and well understood, so I'm inclined to stick with
it, if possible.

I haven't looked seriously at Alpha emulation. What's the
situation (network or any) for (free) Alpha emulation on a
Mac?
Steven Schweda
2017-06-06 20:48:02 UTC
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Post by Steven Schweda
with my (90TL) terminal servers, but SET HOST /DTE is old,
Oops. I meant "SET HOST /LAT". (I was playing with "SET
HOST /DTE" earlier, and my brain is old and weak.)

But, while I'm at it, I see that an rx2600 has a couple of
normal-looking (9-pin) serial ports (not on the MP). Does
VMS see those as TTA0+TTB0, as on, say, an XP1000? I have my
X10 FireCracker (CM17A) gizmo to deal with, too. (Unless I
convert everything to wireless-IP sockets, which would also
cost extra. Everything's complicated.)
Hans Vlems
2017-06-06 21:10:56 UTC
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An rx2600 has two serial ports that connect the same way an XP1000 does. I use cables with two female DB9 connectors between VAXes, Alphas and IA64's to allow SET HOST/DTE, which works quite well. Even cheap DB9 to USB cables work on all three platforms.

Should you find a replacement power supply for the XP1000 then please let us know. I've got just one and no spares.
Hans
David Froble
2017-06-06 21:45:49 UTC
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Post by Hans Vlems
An rx2600 has two serial ports that connect the same way an XP1000 does. I use cables with two female DB9 connectors between VAXes, Alphas and IA64's to allow SET HOST/DTE, which works quite well. Even cheap DB9 to USB cables work on all three platforms.
Should you find a replacement power supply for the XP1000 then please let us know. I've got just one and no spares.
Hans
David Turner appears to have some, new or refurbished. Around $250. That might
seem a bit much if you consider the entire system worth less.
V***@SendSpamHere.ORG
2017-06-06 23:45:14 UTC
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Post by David Froble
Post by Hans Vlems
An rx2600 has two serial ports that connect the same way an XP1000 does. I use cables with two female DB9 connectors between VAXes, Alphas and IA64's to allow SET HOST/DTE, which works quite well. Even cheap DB9 to USB cables work on all three platform
Should you find a replacement power supply for the XP1000 then please let us know. I've got just one and no spares.
Hans
David Turner appears to have some, new or refurbished. Around $250. That might
seem a bit much if you consider the entire system worth less.
Was the supply you need used in any other Alpha h/w? I have many Alphas here but not
an XP1000.
--
VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)ORG

I speak to machines with the voice of humanity.
Steven Schweda
2017-06-07 01:22:38 UTC
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Post by V***@SendSpamHere.ORG
Was the supply you need used in any other Alpha h/w?
My quick Web search found none.
Post by V***@SendSpamHere.ORG
I have many Alphas here but not an XP1000.
You missed out. Reasonable features, relatively cheap,
low power (<500W, I think), ... More than 2GB of memory
would've been nice, but it probably seemed like plenty in
1999 (before a Web browser could devour multiples of that.)

If anyone's giving away DS15 systems, then I might take
one (or two) of those in preference to a cheap XP1000 power
supply (or two), but my expectations are low.
David Froble
2017-06-07 04:37:29 UTC
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Post by V***@SendSpamHere.ORG
Post by David Froble
Post by Hans Vlems
An rx2600 has two serial ports that connect the same way an XP1000 does. I use cables with two female DB9 connectors between VAXes, Alphas and IA64's to allow SET HOST/DTE, which works quite well. Even cheap DB9 to USB cables work on all three platform
Should you find a replacement power supply for the XP1000 then please let us know. I've got just one and no spares.
Hans
David Turner appears to have some, new or refurbished. Around $250. That might
seem a bit much if you consider the entire system worth less.
Was the supply you need used in any other Alpha h/w? I have many Alphas here but not
an XP1000.
I believe (whatever that means) that the XP1000 was the workstation version of a
DS10.
Steven Schweda
2017-06-07 04:55:40 UTC
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Post by David Froble
I believe (whatever that means) that the XP1000 was the
workstation version of a DS10.
That means that you believe wrong. The XP900 and DS10
were siblings. The XP1000 was different (cheaper).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AlphaStation

(Or is Wikipedia too much like open-source software to be
acceptable in your environment?)

I might settle for a pair of incredible-bargain DS10
systems, too, but I'm not holding my breath. (And I have a
lifetime supply of XP1000 memory which I would not want to go
to waste.)
John Reagan
2017-06-07 11:45:17 UTC
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Post by Steven Schweda
Post by David Froble
I believe (whatever that means) that the XP1000 was the
workstation version of a DS10.
That means that you believe wrong. The XP900 and DS10
were siblings. The XP1000 was different (cheaper).
Yep. And so different that the latest SRM won't work on the XP1000 due to it being different. And remember the TOY clock issue about the XP1000s from a few years back?

I have one of the top-o-the-line XP1000s here at home: the EV67 chip and 2GB of memory (the machine was doing some Java testing at the time).
Stephen Hoffman
2017-06-07 16:25:40 UTC
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Post by John Reagan
And so different that the latest SRM won't work on the XP1000 due to it
being different.
If you don't already know it, remind me some time and I'll tell you the
story behind that.
--
Pure Personal Opinion | HoffmanLabs LLC
Hans Vlems
2017-06-07 18:35:00 UTC
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This time being as good as any other time and besides I own one Hoff!
So please go ahead
Hans
Alan Frisbie
2017-06-07 19:26:10 UTC
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Post by John Reagan
And so different that the latest SRM won't work on the XP1000 due to it being different.
If you don't already know it, remind me some time and I'll tell you the story behind that.
Please tell it here. I own one (used daily) and would like to know.

Thanks,
Alan
V***@SendSpamHere.ORG
2017-06-07 13:34:57 UTC
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Post by David Froble
Post by V***@SendSpamHere.ORG
Post by David Froble
Post by Hans Vlems
An rx2600 has two serial ports that connect the same way an XP1000 does. I use cables with two female DB9 connectors between VAXes, Alphas and IA64's to allow SET HOST/DTE, which works quite well. Even cheap DB9 to USB cables work on all three platfo
Should you find a replacement power supply for the XP1000 then please let us know. I've got just one and no spares.
Hans
David Turner appears to have some, new or refurbished. Around $250. That might
seem a bit much if you consider the entire system worth less.
Was the supply you need used in any other Alpha h/w? I have many Alphas here but not
an XP1000.
I believe (whatever that means) that the XP1000 was the workstation version of a
DS10.
I do have DS10 kit.
--
VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)ORG

I speak to machines with the voice of humanity.
David Froble
2017-06-07 13:46:04 UTC
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Post by V***@SendSpamHere.ORG
Post by David Froble
Post by V***@SendSpamHere.ORG
Post by David Froble
Post by Hans Vlems
An rx2600 has two serial ports that connect the same way an XP1000 does. I use cables with two female DB9 connectors between VAXes, Alphas and IA64's to allow SET HOST/DTE, which works quite well. Even cheap DB9 to USB cables work on all three platfo
Should you find a replacement power supply for the XP1000 then please let us know. I've got just one and no spares.
Hans
David Turner appears to have some, new or refurbished. Around $250. That might
seem a bit much if you consider the entire system worth less.
Was the supply you need used in any other Alpha h/w? I have many Alphas here but not
an XP1000.
I believe (whatever that means) that the XP1000 was the workstation version of a
DS10.
I do have DS10 kit.
Steven has informed us that I have again been wrong. Apparently I confused the
XP900 with the XP1000.
David Turner
2017-06-07 13:53:47 UTC
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We sell new ones
They are the same as the DS15 power supply just with a longer cable (we
make a pigtail for them)

In stock IC-ZXP10-RP

www.islandco.com
Post by Hans Vlems
An rx2600 has two serial ports that connect the same way an XP1000 does. I use cables with two female DB9 connectors between VAXes, Alphas and IA64's to allow SET HOST/DTE, which works quite well. Even cheap DB9 to USB cables work on all three platforms.
Should you find a replacement power supply for the XP1000 then please let us know. I've got just one and no spares.
Hans
Steven Schweda
2017-06-07 14:06:15 UTC
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Post by David Turner
In stock IC-ZXP10-RP
Good to know, but a $425 PS for a $300 hobbyist system
might be hard for me to justify. (Well, if I include the
new(er) disks, the gigabit Ethernet and SCSI cards, and so
on, the system cost might be close to the PS price.)
abrsvc
2017-06-06 19:37:27 UTC
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I tried to send you an Email, but it was rejected. Shoot me an Email at the address below and I'll indicate some options for you.

Dan

***@yahoo.com
Scott Dorsey
2017-06-07 12:54:57 UTC
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Post by Steven Schweda
Today I mourn the power supply in my main XP1000 system
(RIP). My spare/experimental XP1000 (which usually runs
Tru64, when it runs at all) donated its, but now I'm down to
no spares (and no Tru64), so I'm interested in one or two
(low-cost) replacements. Anyone out there with a surplus?
These usually are not hard supplies to fix. What is it doing? Did it fail
while running or did it just refuse to turn on one day? When you turn it on
do the lights flash briefly? Do you hear a clicking sound?
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
Steven Schweda
2017-06-07 13:52:14 UTC
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Post by Scott Dorsey
These usually are not hard supplies to fix. What is it
doing? Did it fail while running or did it just refuse to
turn on one day? When you turn it on do the lights flash
briefly? Do you hear a clicking sound?
I opened one in 2007 when it suddenly died, and it didn't
look easy to me. ("Easy to me" is a bulging filter capacitor
or a fried-looking diode.) Thanks to the compact design,
it's hard to gain access to any parts while the thing is
assembled enough to let it operate. If I had some
semi-exotic cables to connect the two halves, a suitable
dummy load, a schematic diagram, some empty work space, more
time and ambition, and probably a few more things, then I
might be trying to do more with it.

This being my main system, it was on at the time. When I
noticed that I had lost contact with the system, the PS
seemed to be pulsing at about 1Hz, trying (and failing) to
keep its output up. My first suspect was the UPS, but
bypassing that gave the same result. Any sound from the PS
was masked by the fans (and my panic when I saw the pulsing
operation).

I've already got an offer from a fellow who claims to have
hope of repairing and/or replacing it, so I'm pursuing that.

If you intend to keep it forever (on a negligible budget),
then there's much to be said for buying popular hardware with
common parts. (A Dell workstation, for example. This
DEC/Compaq junk which can't be trusted to work for thirty
years can be a nuisance.)
Scott Dorsey
2017-06-07 14:57:45 UTC
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Post by Steven Schweda
Post by Scott Dorsey
These usually are not hard supplies to fix. What is it
doing? Did it fail while running or did it just refuse to
turn on one day? When you turn it on do the lights flash
briefly? Do you hear a clicking sound?
I opened one in 2007 when it suddenly died, and it didn't
look easy to me. ("Easy to me" is a bulging filter capacitor
or a fried-looking diode.) Thanks to the compact design,
it's hard to gain access to any parts while the thing is
assembled enough to let it operate. If I had some
semi-exotic cables to connect the two halves, a suitable
dummy load, a schematic diagram, some empty work space, more
time and ambition, and probably a few more things, then I
might be trying to do more with it.
Oh, if you think these are bad, you should see the supplies in rackmount PCs!
On those you have to remove heatsinks and desolder the heatsinked components
just to get to electrolytic caps hidden under the heatsink!
Post by Steven Schweda
This being my main system, it was on at the time. When I
noticed that I had lost contact with the system, the PS
seemed to be pulsing at about 1Hz, trying (and failing) to
keep its output up. My first suspect was the UPS, but
bypassing that gave the same result. Any sound from the PS
was masked by the fans (and my panic when I saw the pulsing
operation).
It's crowbarring because the controller thinks there is too much load. Replace
_all_ of the output electrolytics on the secondary side of the transformer.
The controller is only looking at the 5V rail but change them all out.

If that fails to fix the problem then start doing actual diagnosis and looking
at the waveform on the secondary of the optoisolator. But odds are you will
not have to do any real troubleshooting.
Post by Steven Schweda
I've already got an offer from a fellow who claims to have
hope of repairing and/or replacing it, so I'm pursuing that.
It's not hard to work on. It's tight inside there, but it's not crazy.
Post by Steven Schweda
If you intend to keep it forever (on a negligible budget),
then there's much to be said for buying popular hardware with
common parts. (A Dell workstation, for example. This
DEC/Compaq junk which can't be trusted to work for thirty
years can be a nuisance.)
I'll take something like this over an M7270 card with a big hole in it from
where the tantalum cap was....
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
Chris
2017-06-08 00:01:29 UTC
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Post by Scott Dorsey
It's crowbarring because the controller thinks there is too much load. Replace
_all_ of the output electrolytics on the secondary side of the transformer.
The controller is only looking at the 5V rail but change them all out.
I'll second that. One of the first things to do getting a used system,
especially older kit, is to replace all the psu caps and fans(s)
before putting it into service. Bigger fans if they will go in the box
as well. Most recently, Cobalt web servers repurposed as firewalls,
where the fan had given up and all the psu caps bulged out at the
ends, even though the unit still worked. Depending on cooling, 5-10
years continuous use at the max. Modern caps are better specced for
the same values. Smaller size, lower impedance and longer life and
not expensive.

Electrolytic caps have a very finite life, inversely related to
temperature. Nothing much else fails on switchers otherwise, ime...

Chris
Scott Dorsey
2017-06-08 13:36:03 UTC
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Post by Chris
Post by Scott Dorsey
It's crowbarring because the controller thinks there is too much load. Replace
_all_ of the output electrolytics on the secondary side of the transformer.
The controller is only looking at the 5V rail but change them all out.
I'll second that. One of the first things to do getting a used system,
especially older kit, is to replace all the psu caps and fans(s)
before putting it into service. Bigger fans if they will go in the box
as well. Most recently, Cobalt web servers repurposed as firewalls,
where the fan had given up and all the psu caps bulged out at the
ends, even though the unit still worked. Depending on cooling, 5-10
years continuous use at the max. Modern caps are better specced for
the same values. Smaller size, lower impedance and longer life and
not expensive.
Electrolytic caps have a very finite life, inversely related to
temperature. Nothing much else fails on switchers otherwise, ime...
It's the most common failure, but I see all kinds of other stuff going.
The power supplies in the BA123 have a particular failure mode where the
damper diode on the big switching fet fails, the switching fet fails into
a dead short from the high voltage peaks it sees with the diode gone, and
with the fet gate connected to 160V the gate drive circuit fails. I see
all the time supplies with the controller chip gone bad, and switching
transistor failures.

But this one, like most failures of supplies this age, is a capacitor failure,
and it's a failure of the capacitors on the secondary side of the 5V supply.
--scott
Post by Chris
Chris
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
David Turner
2017-06-07 13:56:33 UTC
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We stock the power supply for the XP1000 - our version new - IC-ZXP10-RP
It is slightly shorter than the compaq verison so there is more interior
space
3 yr warranty

David
www.islandco.com
Post by Steven Schweda
Today I mourn the power supply in my main XP1000 system
(RIP). My spare/experimental XP1000 (which usually runs
Tru64, when it runs at all) donated its, but now I'm down to
no spares (and no Tru64), so I'm interested in one or two
(low-cost) replacements. Anyone out there with a surplus?
AcBel
API-6108
DIGITAL P/N : 30-48584-01
DATE : A 9911 REV. : A05
CTL No. : A05
I suppose that the real solution would be to migrate
"mainness" to an IA64 system (which, unlike the XP1000
systems, is not yet old enough to vote), but that would be
actual work, and would require setting up an rx26000 in the
basement, where I wouldn't be forced to listen to it most of
the time (more work).
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