Discussion:
VSI Webinar 9-April
Add Reply
Jan-Erik Söderholm
2019-03-29 16:23:42 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Just signed up for the VSI Webinar at the 9-April.
(There are three differnt times to cover all/most TZ's).

The agenda:

- VSI Senior Managers Terry Holmes and Eddie Orcutt will discuss
the latest decision by HPE to discontinue selling new VSI licenses
and support and provide an update on new VSI products including
the x-86 product.

Just if someone else is interested...

http://vmssoftware.com/updates_webinars.html
Simon Clubley
2019-03-29 21:49:59 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On 2019-03-29, Jan-Erik Söderholm <jan-***@telia.com> wrote:
> Just signed up for the VSI Webinar at the 9-April.
> (There are three differnt times to cover all/most TZ's).
>
> The agenda:
>
> - VSI Senior Managers Terry Holmes and Eddie Orcutt will discuss
> the latest decision by HPE to discontinue selling new VSI licenses
> and support and provide an update on new VSI products including
> the x-86 product.
>
> Just if someone else is interested...
>
> http://vmssoftware.com/updates_webinars.html
>

I did not know about HPE stopping those sales.

Does anyone know why, given that HPE have a while to go before
they stop supporting their own VMS customers ?

On the face of it, that could be bad for VSI (at least when it
comes to some customers) because there will be those who are more
comfortable dealing with a large established company like HPE rather
than a startup like VSI.

BTW, in this case, it's not what _we_ think when it comes to HPE vs VSI.
What matters is what the people with the cheque books think.

Simon.

--
Simon Clubley, ***@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP
Microsoft: Bringing you 1980s technology to a 21st century world
Dave Froble
2019-03-30 00:16:08 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On 3/29/2019 5:49 PM, Simon Clubley wrote:
> On 2019-03-29, Jan-Erik Söderholm <jan-***@telia.com> wrote:
>> Just signed up for the VSI Webinar at the 9-April.
>> (There are three differnt times to cover all/most TZ's).
>>
>> The agenda:
>>
>> - VSI Senior Managers Terry Holmes and Eddie Orcutt will discuss
>> the latest decision by HPE to discontinue selling new VSI licenses
>> and support and provide an update on new VSI products including
>> the x-86 product.
>>
>> Just if someone else is interested...
>>
>> http://vmssoftware.com/updates_webinars.html
>>
>
> I did not know about HPE stopping those sales.
>
> Does anyone know why, given that HPE have a while to go before
> they stop supporting their own VMS customers ?
>
> On the face of it, that could be bad for VSI (at least when it
> comes to some customers) because there will be those who are more
> comfortable dealing with a large established company like HPE rather
> than a startup like VSI.
>
> BTW, in this case, it's not what _we_ think when it comes to HPE vs VSI.
> What matters is what the people with the cheque books think.
>
> Simon.
>

I've seen the mentality. Without getting into names and places, a
software vendor didn't deliver what was agreed to.

Three times, count them, 1, 2, 3, the customer went to the vendor, and
asked the question, "what will it take to get what was agreed upon?"
Each time the vendor quoted an amount, and the customer coughed up the
money. Each time the vendor put an incompetent person on the project,
counted off the money as an hourly charge, and when the money ran out,
stopped the work.

Frankly, after the first time, when the lesson wasn't learned, I stopped
feeling sorry for the customer. There was another vendor which could
have completed the project, the customer talked to them, but then would
go back to the crooks.

So, if there are any fools who still want to throw money at HPE, I'm
sure HPE will figure out some way to take the money, but, they will most
likely never give back any value for the money.

Have at, if you must ....

--
David Froble Tel: 724-529-0450
Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc. E-Mail: ***@tsoft-inc.com
DFE Ultralights, Inc.
170 Grimplin Road
Vanderbilt, PA 15486
gérard Calliet
2019-04-03 13:08:06 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Le 29/03/2019 à 22:49, Simon Clubley a écrit :
> On the face of it, that could be bad for VSI (at least when it
> comes to some customers) because there will be those who are more
> comfortable dealing with a large established company like HPE rather
> than a startup like VSI.
I totally agree on that. Even when HPE was still here, dealing somehow
not only with the big company but also with a little start-up was
difficult at the head of big companies. Now it will be worse.

And because of the lack of real information about VMS, the announce will
be heard again as a new death for VMS.

And for a lot of situations HPE (or some people in it) are the only one
to know about existent users.

However it is the result of 2 wrong policies: from HP(E) and from VSI.
Here HP(E) confirms it does'nt understand anything about VMS business.
VSI confirms it wants to develop as a standard startup boomer without
really understanding the specifities of VMS ecosystem.

And it is the result of 3 to 5 years of these 2 wrong policies. From
2014 VSI had the opportunity of making intense community-oriented
marketing (it would have been done for almost free by the VMS lovers),
scientific debriefing about its qualities, and proving to HP(E) they
could think for the future of getting profit from an original market on
which they had less to do. From HP(E) just doing what they had
contracted, and getting the opportunity of getting the most on
end-of-life Itanium sellings. But, in each side, what is lacking is
thinking industrial strategies. Just thinking (KISS) "because we are
good, we'll make money" (The wall street company, and the Steve Jobs
company, not the Hewlett and Packard heirs, not the Ken Olsen heirs).

It is just analysis about past, so I'll stop on it. But strategic errors
remain strategic errors, and everybody here knows how strategic errors
can destroy a big worldwide company. There are been here a lot of
"Alas!" about DEC destiny. I innovate because I give my "Alas!" just in
time.

I think the situation for the future of VMS is again very complicated,
and for sure, I'll say my "Alas!" only "off the record", and, as a good
marketer, explain the new situation is very good news, new opportunity,
and so on.

But I think it is again very important if we want a future for VMS to
think different, to search for the specificities of the VMS ecosystem
and community to leverage on them, and to stop the worst bad idea which
killed DEC which was "because we product the best, we'll have profit".
Id didn't completely work in a time it could work, and in our times it's
just suicide.

I know I'm saying tought analysis. Hear that as a friendly warning, a
warning caused by a very strong friendship and hope about a very
exciting adventure.

Again and again, I have to say that the VMS community will have a strong
role on the success of new VMS. That we have to sustain a
for-sustainbility market, and that it is a very specific work, in a
sense more innovating than that can be said about the nowadays "shooting
stars".

Best,

Gérard Calliet
l***@gmail.com
2019-04-03 17:23:37 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Wednesday, April 3, 2019 at 6:08:10 AM UTC-7, gérard Calliet wrote:
> Le 29/03/2019 à 22:49, Simon Clubley a écrit :
> > On the face of it, that could be bad for VSI (at least when it
> > comes to some customers) because there will be those who are more
> > comfortable dealing with a large established company like HPE rather
> > than a startup like VSI.
> I totally agree on that. Even when HPE was still here, dealing somehow
> not only with the big company but also with a little start-up was
> difficult at the head of big companies. Now it will be worse.
> ...%<snip>%...

> Again and again, I have to say that the VMS community will have a strong
> role on the success of new VMS. That we have to sustain a
> for-sustainbility market, and that it is a very specific work, in a
> sense more innovating than that can be said about the nowadays "shooting
> stars".
>
> Best,
>
> Gérard Calliet

So well said, Gérard ... +1
gérard Calliet
2019-04-04 07:58:30 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Le 03/04/2019 à 19:23, ***@gmail.com a écrit :
> On Wednesday, April 3, 2019 at 6:08:10 AM UTC-7, gérard Calliet wrote:
>> Le 29/03/2019 à 22:49, Simon Clubley a écrit :
>>> On the face of it, that could be bad for VSI (at least when it
>>> comes to some customers) because there will be those who are more
>>> comfortable dealing with a large established company like HPE rather
>>> than a startup like VSI.
>> I totally agree on that. Even when HPE was still here, dealing somehow
>> not only with the big company but also with a little start-up was
>> difficult at the head of big companies. Now it will be worse.
>> ...%<snip>%...
>
>> Again and again, I have to say that the VMS community will have a strong
>> role on the success of new VMS. That we have to sustain a
>> for-sustainbility market, and that it is a very specific work, in a
>> sense more innovating than that can be said about the nowadays "shooting
>> stars".
>>
>> Best,
>>
>> Gérard Calliet
>
> So well said, Gérard ... +1
>
Hello Lorin,

I do appreciate your art of summarizing :)
The next question is what can we do next?

Gérard Calliet
Neil Rieck
2019-04-04 11:55:48 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Friday, March 29, 2019 at 5:50:01 PM UTC-4, Simon Clubley wrote:
> On 2019-03-29, Jan-Erik Söderholm <jan-***@telia.com> wrote:
> > Just signed up for the VSI Webinar at the 9-April.
> > (There are three differnt times to cover all/most TZ's).
> >
> > The agenda:
> >
> > - VSI Senior Managers Terry Holmes and Eddie Orcutt will discuss
> > the latest decision by HPE to discontinue selling new VSI licenses
> > and support and provide an update on new VSI products including
> > the x-86 product.
> >
> > Just if someone else is interested...
> >
> > http://vmssoftware.com/updates_webinars.html
> >
>
> I did not know about HPE stopping those sales.
>
> Does anyone know why, given that HPE have a while to go before
> they stop supporting their own VMS customers ?
>
> On the face of it, that could be bad for VSI (at least when it
> comes to some customers) because there will be those who are more
> comfortable dealing with a large established company like HPE rather
> than a startup like VSI.
>
> BTW, in this case, it's not what _we_ think when it comes to HPE vs VSI.
> What matters is what the people with the cheque books think.
>
> Simon.
>
> --
> Simon Clubley, ***@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP
> Microsoft: Bringing you 1980s technology to a 21st century world

I forget where I saw it, but HPE will no longer offer OpenVMS software support of any kind after 2020.

Speculation: "I think" VSI does not offer "engineering support" for OpenVMS-8.4 but HPE does. So "I think" when HPE exits that business then VSI will pick it up.

Neil Rieck
Waterloo, Ontario, Canada.
http://neilrieck.net
j***@gmail.com
2019-04-04 13:26:28 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Thursday, April 4, 2019 at 7:55:50 AM UTC-4, Neil Rieck wrote:
> I forget where I saw it, but HPE will no longer offer OpenVMS software
> support of any kind after 2020.

Clearly marked in the roadmap.

https://support.hpe.com/hpsc/doc/public/display?docId=emr_na-c04623087

EJ
Robert A. Brooks
2019-04-04 15:16:52 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On 4/4/2019 7:55 AM, Neil Rieck wrote:

> I forget where I saw it, but HPE will no longer offer OpenVMS
> software support of any kind after 2020.
>
> Speculation: "I think" VSI does not offer "engineering support" for
> OpenVMS-8.4 but HPE does. So "I think" when HPE exits that business
> then VSI will pick it up.

We (VSI) cannot offer engineering support on any HPE version of VMS.

By "engineering support", I mean that we cannot build patches to fix problems found.

We can offer phone support, although I don't know if we'll do that.

---

-- Rob
Dave Froble
2019-04-04 15:33:14 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On 4/4/2019 11:16 AM, Robert A. Brooks wrote:
> On 4/4/2019 7:55 AM, Neil Rieck wrote:
>
>> I forget where I saw it, but HPE will no longer offer OpenVMS
>> software support of any kind after 2020.
>>
>> Speculation: "I think" VSI does not offer "engineering support" for
>> OpenVMS-8.4 but HPE does. So "I think" when HPE exits that business
>> then VSI will pick it up.
>
> We (VSI) cannot offer engineering support on any HPE version of VMS.

Idle speculation, it's a slow morning ....

One wonders if HP(e) actively wants all users off their versions of VMs,
for various reasons,

or,

Perhaps HP(e) would relax such restraints once they are fully out of the
VMS business, (which they basically are already).

Then comes the question, would VSI want that business, since it is not
what they shouold be spending time on?

> By "engineering support", I mean that we cannot build patches to fix problems found.

I'm assuming you already have, for VSI releases, or will do so when any
are found.

> We can offer phone support, although I don't know if we'll do that.

Read as "we have better things to do".

Anybody that will continue to use current release VMS should be on a VSI
version. Others, don't matter ....


--
David Froble Tel: 724-529-0450
Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc. E-Mail: ***@tsoft-inc.com
DFE Ultralights, Inc.
170 Grimplin Road
Vanderbilt, PA 15486
Ian Miller
2019-04-01 09:25:56 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Friday, March 29, 2019 at 4:23:46 PM UTC, Jan-Erik Söderholm wrote:
> Just signed up for the VSI Webinar at the 9-April.
> (There are three differnt times to cover all/most TZ's).
>
> The agenda:
>
> - VSI Senior Managers Terry Holmes and Eddie Orcutt will discuss
> the latest decision by HPE to discontinue selling new VSI licenses
> and support and provide an update on new VSI products including
> the x-86 product.
>
> Just if someone else is interested...
>
> http://vmssoftware.com/updates_webinars.html

Yup. the next step in the transition now has a date.

Existing contracts for OpenVMS software support with HPE will continue as they do now. Renewals will have to be carefully thought about. New contracts should go to VSI.
p***@gmail.com
2019-04-01 19:43:46 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Monday, April 1, 2019 at 5:25:58 AM UTC-4, Ian Miller wrote:
> On Friday, March 29, 2019 at 4:23:46 PM UTC, Jan-Erik Söderholm wrote:
> > Just signed up for the VSI Webinar at the 9-April.
> > (There are three differnt times to cover all/most TZ's).
> >
> > The agenda:
> >
> > - VSI Senior Managers Terry Holmes and Eddie Orcutt will discuss
> > the latest decision by HPE to discontinue selling new VSI licenses
> > and support and provide an update on new VSI products including
> > the x-86 product.
> >
> > Just if someone else is interested...
> >
> > http://vmssoftware.com/updates_webinars.html
>
> Yup. the next step in the transition now has a date.
>
> Existing contracts for OpenVMS software support with HPE will continue as they do now. Renewals will have to be carefully thought about. New contracts should go to VSI.



I was told they are no longer selling their own licenses either. if you want an add on product you're SOL too...
Robert A. Brooks
2019-04-01 20:07:19 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On 4/1/2019 3:43 PM, ***@gmail.com wrote:
> On Monday, April 1, 2019 at 5:25:58 AM UTC-4, Ian Miller wrote:

>> Existing contracts for OpenVMS software support with HPE will
>> continue as they do now. Renewals will have to be carefully thought
>> about. New contracts should go to VSI.
>
> I was told they are no longer selling their own licenses either. if
> you want an add on product you're SOL too...

What "add-on" product are you talking about that VSI cannot provide
(hence the "SOL" comment)?

--

-- Rob
Jan-Erik Söderholm
2019-04-01 20:13:14 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Den 2019-04-01 kl. 22:07, skrev Robert A. Brooks:
> On 4/1/2019 3:43 PM, ***@gmail.com wrote:
>> On Monday, April 1, 2019 at 5:25:58 AM UTC-4, Ian Miller wrote:
>
>>> Existing contracts for OpenVMS software support with HPE will
>>> continue as they do now. Renewals will have to be carefully thought
>>> about. New contracts should go to VSI.
>>
>> I was told they are no longer selling their own licenses either. if
>> you want an add on product you're SOL too...
>
> What "add-on" product are you talking about that VSI cannot provide
> (hence the "SOL" comment)?
>

I think "they" refered to HPE and an VSI "add-on" would not work
together with an "HPE VMS" system, does it? You then need to do
a full HPE to VSI transition of your licenses, not?
p***@gmail.com
2019-04-01 20:16:29 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Monday, April 1, 2019 at 4:13:18 PM UTC-4, Jan-Erik Söderholm wrote:
> Den 2019-04-01 kl. 22:07, skrev Robert A. Brooks:
> > On 4/1/2019 3:43 PM, ***@gmail.com wrote:
> >> On Monday, April 1, 2019 at 5:25:58 AM UTC-4, Ian Miller wrote:
> >
> >>> Existing contracts for OpenVMS software support with HPE will
> >>> continue as they do now. Renewals will have to be carefully thought
> >>> about. New contracts should go to VSI.
> >>
> >> I was told they are no longer selling their own licenses either. if
> >> you want an add on product you're SOL too...
> >
> > What "add-on" product are you talking about that VSI cannot provide
> > (hence the "SOL" comment)?
> >
>
> I think "they" refered to HPE and an VSI "add-on" would not work
> together with an "HPE VMS" system, does it? You then need to do
> a full HPE to VSI transition of your licenses, not?

no an HPE product! I was interested in a 'C' license for 8.4 and was told they were not selling anymore licensing for HPE VMS.
Robert A. Brooks
2019-04-01 20:30:36 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On 4/1/2019 4:16 PM, ***@gmail.com wrote:
> On Monday, April 1, 2019 at 4:13:18 PM UTC-4, Jan-Erik Söderholm
> wrote:
>> Den 2019-04-01 kl. 22:07, skrev Robert A. Brooks:
>>> On 4/1/2019 3:43 PM, ***@gmail.com wrote:
>>>> On Monday, April 1, 2019 at 5:25:58 AM UTC-4, Ian Miller
>>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>> Existing contracts for OpenVMS software support with HPE
>>>>> will continue as they do now. Renewals will have to be
>>>>> carefully thought about. New contracts should go to VSI.
>>>>
>>>> I was told they are no longer selling their own licenses
>>>> either. if you want an add on product you're SOL too...
>>>
>>> What "add-on" product are you talking about that VSI cannot
>>> provide (hence the "SOL" comment)?
>>>
>>
>> I think "they" refered to HPE and an VSI "add-on" would not work
>> together with an "HPE VMS" system, does it? You then need to do a
>> full HPE to VSI transition of your licenses, not?
>
> no an HPE product! I was interested in a 'C' license for 8.4 and was
> told they were not selling anymore licensing for HPE VMS.

The point of my comment was that while it may be a bit of a pain
to change your VMS provider from HPE to VSI, we are here and are happy
to sell stuff, including C licenses, such that you are not SOL.

--

-- Rob
p***@gmail.com
2019-04-01 20:40:04 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Monday, April 1, 2019 at 4:30:38 PM UTC-4, Robert A. Brooks wrote:
> On 4/1/2019 4:16 PM, ***@gmail.com wrote:
> > On Monday, April 1, 2019 at 4:13:18 PM UTC-4, Jan-Erik Söderholm
> > wrote:
> >> Den 2019-04-01 kl. 22:07, skrev Robert A. Brooks:
> >>> On 4/1/2019 3:43 PM, ***@gmail.com wrote:
> >>>> On Monday, April 1, 2019 at 5:25:58 AM UTC-4, Ian Miller
> >>>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>>> Existing contracts for OpenVMS software support with HPE
> >>>>> will continue as they do now. Renewals will have to be
> >>>>> carefully thought about. New contracts should go to VSI.
> >>>>
> >>>> I was told they are no longer selling their own licenses
> >>>> either. if you want an add on product you're SOL too...
> >>>
> >>> What "add-on" product are you talking about that VSI cannot
> >>> provide (hence the "SOL" comment)?
> >>>
> >>
> >> I think "they" refered to HPE and an VSI "add-on" would not work
> >> together with an "HPE VMS" system, does it? You then need to do a
> >> full HPE to VSI transition of your licenses, not?
> >
> > no an HPE product! I was interested in a 'C' license for 8.4 and was
> > told they were not selling anymore licensing for HPE VMS.
>
> The point of my comment was that while it may be a bit of a pain
> to change your VMS provider from HPE to VSI, we are here and are happy
> to sell stuff, including C licenses, such that you are not SOL.
>
> --
>
> -- Rob

I'm already a VSI support customer. still running 8.4 unfortunately for now due to app vendor mostly.
Dave Froble
2019-04-01 21:39:13 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On 4/1/2019 4:40 PM, ***@gmail.com wrote:
> On Monday, April 1, 2019 at 4:30:38 PM UTC-4, Robert A. Brooks wrote:
>> On 4/1/2019 4:16 PM, ***@gmail.com wrote:
>>> On Monday, April 1, 2019 at 4:13:18 PM UTC-4, Jan-Erik Söderholm
>>> wrote:
>>>> Den 2019-04-01 kl. 22:07, skrev Robert A. Brooks:
>>>>> On 4/1/2019 3:43 PM, ***@gmail.com wrote:
>>>>>> On Monday, April 1, 2019 at 5:25:58 AM UTC-4, Ian Miller
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>> Existing contracts for OpenVMS software support with HPE
>>>>>>> will continue as they do now. Renewals will have to be
>>>>>>> carefully thought about. New contracts should go to VSI.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I was told they are no longer selling their own licenses
>>>>>> either. if you want an add on product you're SOL too...
>>>>>
>>>>> What "add-on" product are you talking about that VSI cannot
>>>>> provide (hence the "SOL" comment)?
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I think "they" refered to HPE and an VSI "add-on" would not work
>>>> together with an "HPE VMS" system, does it? You then need to do a
>>>> full HPE to VSI transition of your licenses, not?
>>>
>>> no an HPE product! I was interested in a 'C' license for 8.4 and was
>>> told they were not selling anymore licensing for HPE VMS.
>>
>> The point of my comment was that while it may be a bit of a pain
>> to change your VMS provider from HPE to VSI, we are here and are happy
>> to sell stuff, including C licenses, such that you are not SOL.
>>
>> --
>>
>> -- Rob
>
> I'm already a VSI support customer. still running 8.4 unfortunately for now due to app vendor mostly.
>

Well, that begets 2 questions.

What is stopping the app vendor from supporting their app on VSI VMS
V8.4 2L?

Will the VSI C compiler not work on your HPE VMS V8.4 system?

Got a spare system you can run the VSI OS on? I'd be rather surprised
if the obj file would not be transferable between systems.

--
David Froble Tel: 724-529-0450
Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc. E-Mail: ***@tsoft-inc.com
DFE Ultralights, Inc.
170 Grimplin Road
Vanderbilt, PA 15486
p***@gmail.com
2019-04-02 14:45:21 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Monday, April 1, 2019 at 5:39:37 PM UTC-4, Dave Froble wrote:
> On 4/1/2019 4:40 PM, ***@gmail.com wrote:
> > On Monday, April 1, 2019 at 4:30:38 PM UTC-4, Robert A. Brooks wrote:
> >> On 4/1/2019 4:16 PM, ***@gmail.com wrote:
> >>> On Monday, April 1, 2019 at 4:13:18 PM UTC-4, Jan-Erik Söderholm
> >>> wrote:
> >>>> Den 2019-04-01 kl. 22:07, skrev Robert A. Brooks:
> >>>>> On 4/1/2019 3:43 PM, ***@gmail.com wrote:
> >>>>>> On Monday, April 1, 2019 at 5:25:58 AM UTC-4, Ian Miller
> >>>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>> Existing contracts for OpenVMS software support with HPE
> >>>>>>> will continue as they do now. Renewals will have to be
> >>>>>>> carefully thought about. New contracts should go to VSI.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> I was told they are no longer selling their own licenses
> >>>>>> either. if you want an add on product you're SOL too...
> >>>>>
> >>>>> What "add-on" product are you talking about that VSI cannot
> >>>>> provide (hence the "SOL" comment)?
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> I think "they" refered to HPE and an VSI "add-on" would not work
> >>>> together with an "HPE VMS" system, does it? You then need to do a
> >>>> full HPE to VSI transition of your licenses, not?
> >>>
> >>> no an HPE product! I was interested in a 'C' license for 8.4 and was
> >>> told they were not selling anymore licensing for HPE VMS.
> >>
> >> The point of my comment was that while it may be a bit of a pain
> >> to change your VMS provider from HPE to VSI, we are here and are happy
> >> to sell stuff, including C licenses, such that you are not SOL.
> >>
> >> --
> >>
> >> -- Rob
> >
> > I'm already a VSI support customer. still running 8.4 unfortunately for now due to app vendor mostly.
> >
>
> Well, that begets 2 questions.
>
> What is stopping the app vendor from supporting their app on VSI VMS
> V8.4 2L?
>
> Will the VSI C compiler not work on your HPE VMS V8.4 system?
>
> Got a spare system you can run the VSI OS on? I'd be rather surprised
> if the obj file would not be transferable between systems.
>
> --
> David Froble Tel: 724-529-0450
> Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc. E-Mail: ***@tsoft-inc.com
> DFE Ultralights, Inc.
> 170 Grimplin Road
> Vanderbilt, PA 15486

Well, that begets 2 questions. that's 3 though! :-)

What is stopping the app vendor from supporting their app on VSI VMS
V8.4 2L? would have to ask Intersystems

Will the VSI C compiler not work on your HPE VMS V8.4 system? no idea, it's a license issue!

Got a spare system you can run the VSI OS on? I'd be rather surprised
if the obj file would not be transferable between systems.
Nope
Jim
2019-04-02 14:53:26 UTC
Reply
Permalink
>
> Well, that begets 2 questions. that's 3 though! :-)
>
> What is stopping the app vendor from supporting their app on VSI VMS
> V8.4 2L? would have to ask Intersystems
>

Cache DBMS? Ask again... I believe their plans have changed to include
continued support of VMS.
Robert A. Brooks
2019-04-02 15:15:09 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On 4/2/2019 10:53 AM, Jim wrote:
>>
>> Well, that begets 2 questions. that's 3 though! :-)
>>
>> What is stopping the app vendor from supporting their app on VSI VMS
>> V8.4 2L? would have to ask Intersystems
>>
>
> Cache DBMS? Ask again... I believe their plans have changed to include
> continued support of VMS.

They definitely support VSI V8.4-1H1.

--

-- Rob
Stephen Hoffman
2019-04-02 15:22:01 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On 2019-04-02 14:53:26 +0000, Jim said:

> Cache DBMS? Ask again... I believe their plans have changed to include
> continued support of VMS.

If the InterSystems folks have changed their existing 2017.1 plans,
then they're very quiet about it, and haven't clarified nor corrected
existing notices:
https://community.intersystems.com/post/platform-compatibility-hp-open-vms
https://community.intersystems.com/post/vsi-openvms
http://blog.intersystems.com/compatibility/

--
Pure Personal Opinion | HoffmanLabs LLC
p***@gmail.com
2019-04-02 15:34:29 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 11:22:04 AM UTC-4, Stephen Hoffman wrote:
> On 2019-04-02 14:53:26 +0000, Jim said:
>
> > Cache DBMS? Ask again... I believe their plans have changed to include
> > continued support of VMS.
>
> If the InterSystems folks have changed their existing 2017.1 plans,
> then they're very quiet about it, and haven't clarified nor corrected
> existing notices:
> https://community.intersystems.com/post/platform-compatibility-hp-open-vms
> https://community.intersystems.com/post/vsi-openvms
> http://blog.intersystems.com/compatibility/
>
> --
> Pure Personal Opinion | HoffmanLabs LLC

I just looked also with no luck, I did send off an inquiry into it from there website.

I do have plans on testing 8.4-1H1 but just not there yet, but with no plans after that it's a hard sell to management to continue along that path.
John.Spitkovsky_at_mscsinc.com
2019-04-02 18:20:15 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 10:34:31 AM UTC-5, ***@gmail.com wrote:
> On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 11:22:04 AM UTC-4, Stephen Hoffman wrote:
> > On 2019-04-02 14:53:26 +0000, Jim said:
> >
> > > Cache DBMS? Ask again... I believe their plans have changed to include
> > > continued support of VMS.
> >
> > If the InterSystems folks have changed their existing 2017.1 plans,
> > then they're very quiet about it, and haven't clarified nor corrected
> > existing notices:
> > https://community.intersystems.com/post/platform-compatibility-hp-open-vms
> > https://community.intersystems.com/post/vsi-openvms
> > http://blog.intersystems.com/compatibility/
> >
> > --
> > Pure Personal Opinion | HoffmanLabs LLC
>
> I just looked also with no luck, I did send off an inquiry into it from there website.
>
> I do have plans on testing 8.4-1H1 but just not there yet, but with no plans after that it's a hard sell to management to continue along that path.

If it helps, I just took a site running Cache 2012.1.5.956.0.12956 and upgraded from HPE OpenVMS V8.4 to VSI V8.4-1H1. All is still running perfectly and the app users agree!
p***@gmail.com
2019-04-02 18:37:37 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 2:20:17 PM UTC-4, John.Spitkovsky_at_mscsinc.com wrote:
> On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 10:34:31 AM UTC-5, ***@gmail.com wrote:
> > On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 11:22:04 AM UTC-4, Stephen Hoffman wrote:
> > > On 2019-04-02 14:53:26 +0000, Jim said:
> > >
> > > > Cache DBMS? Ask again... I believe their plans have changed to include
> > > > continued support of VMS.
> > >
> > > If the InterSystems folks have changed their existing 2017.1 plans,
> > > then they're very quiet about it, and haven't clarified nor corrected
> > > existing notices:
> > > https://community.intersystems.com/post/platform-compatibility-hp-open-vms
> > > https://community.intersystems.com/post/vsi-openvms
> > > http://blog.intersystems.com/compatibility/
> > >
> > > --
> > > Pure Personal Opinion | HoffmanLabs LLC
> >
> > I just looked also with no luck, I did send off an inquiry into it from there website.
> >
> > I do have plans on testing 8.4-1H1 but just not there yet, but with no plans after that it's a hard sell to management to continue along that path.
>
> If it helps, I just took a site running Cache 2012.1.5.956.0.12956 and upgraded from HPE OpenVMS V8.4 to VSI V8.4-1H1. All is still running perfectly and the app users agree!

depends really on management. what are you running for hardware? and what application? any performance improvements? we are on 2015.1 of cache.

Intersystems is checking on the possibility of using 8.4-2. which would help.
p***@gmail.com
2019-04-02 21:02:03 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 2:37:39 PM UTC-4, ***@gmail.com wrote:
> On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 2:20:17 PM UTC-4, John.Spitkovsky_at_mscsinc.com wrote:
> > On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 10:34:31 AM UTC-5, ***@gmail.com wrote:
> > > On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 11:22:04 AM UTC-4, Stephen Hoffman wrote:
> > > > On 2019-04-02 14:53:26 +0000, Jim said:
> > > >
> > > > > Cache DBMS? Ask again... I believe their plans have changed to include
> > > > > continued support of VMS.
> > > >
> > > > If the InterSystems folks have changed their existing 2017.1 plans,
> > > > then they're very quiet about it, and haven't clarified nor corrected
> > > > existing notices:
> > > > https://community.intersystems.com/post/platform-compatibility-hp-open-vms
> > > > https://community.intersystems.com/post/vsi-openvms
> > > > http://blog.intersystems.com/compatibility/
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Pure Personal Opinion | HoffmanLabs LLC
> > >
> > > I just looked also with no luck, I did send off an inquiry into it from there website.
> > >
> > > I do have plans on testing 8.4-1H1 but just not there yet, but with no plans after that it's a hard sell to management to continue along that path.
> >
> > If it helps, I just took a site running Cache 2012.1.5.956.0.12956 and upgraded from HPE OpenVMS V8.4 to VSI V8.4-1H1. All is still running perfectly and the app users agree!
>
> depends really on management. what are you running for hardware? and what application? any performance improvements? we are on 2015.1 of cache.
>
> Intersystems is checking on the possibility of using 8.4-2. which would help.


just heard back they only support to 8.4-1H1 oh well...
Dave Froble
2019-04-02 21:07:24 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On 4/2/2019 5:02 PM, ***@gmail.com wrote:
> On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 2:37:39 PM UTC-4, ***@gmail.com wrote:
>> On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 2:20:17 PM UTC-4, John.Spitkovsky_at_mscsinc.com wrote:
>>> On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 10:34:31 AM UTC-5, ***@gmail.com wrote:
>>>> On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 11:22:04 AM UTC-4, Stephen Hoffman wrote:
>>>>> On 2019-04-02 14:53:26 +0000, Jim said:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Cache DBMS? Ask again... I believe their plans have changed to include
>>>>>> continued support of VMS.
>>>>>
>>>>> If the InterSystems folks have changed their existing 2017.1 plans,
>>>>> then they're very quiet about it, and haven't clarified nor corrected
>>>>> existing notices:
>>>>> https://community.intersystems.com/post/platform-compatibility-hp-open-vms
>>>>> https://community.intersystems.com/post/vsi-openvms
>>>>> http://blog.intersystems.com/compatibility/
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Pure Personal Opinion | HoffmanLabs LLC
>>>>
>>>> I just looked also with no luck, I did send off an inquiry into it from there website.
>>>>
>>>> I do have plans on testing 8.4-1H1 but just not there yet, but with no plans after that it's a hard sell to management to continue along that path.
>>>
>>> If it helps, I just took a site running Cache 2012.1.5.956.0.12956 and upgraded from HPE OpenVMS V8.4 to VSI V8.4-1H1. All is still running perfectly and the app users agree!
>>
>> depends really on management. what are you running for hardware? and what application? any performance improvements? we are on 2015.1 of cache.
>>
>> Intersystems is checking on the possibility of using 8.4-2. which would help.
>
>
> just heard back they only support to 8.4-1H1 oh well...
>

Isn't that still a VSI release? If so, convert over and get the C
compiler from VSI.

--
David Froble Tel: 724-529-0450
Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc. E-Mail: ***@tsoft-inc.com
DFE Ultralights, Inc.
170 Grimplin Road
Vanderbilt, PA 15486
John.Spitkovsky_at_mscsinc.com
2019-04-09 21:14:00 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 1:37:39 PM UTC-5, ***@gmail.com wrote:
> On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 2:20:17 PM UTC-4, John.Spitkovsky_at_mscsinc.com wrote:
> > On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 10:34:31 AM UTC-5, ***@gmail.com wrote:
> > > On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 11:22:04 AM UTC-4, Stephen Hoffman wrote:
> > > > On 2019-04-02 14:53:26 +0000, Jim said:
> > > >
> > > > > Cache DBMS? Ask again... I believe their plans have changed to include
> > > > > continued support of VMS.
> > > >
> > > > If the InterSystems folks have changed their existing 2017.1 plans,
> > > > then they're very quiet about it, and haven't clarified nor corrected
> > > > existing notices:
> > > > https://community.intersystems.com/post/platform-compatibility-hp-open-vms
> > > > https://community.intersystems.com/post/vsi-openvms
> > > > http://blog.intersystems.com/compatibility/
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Pure Personal Opinion | HoffmanLabs LLC
> > >
> > > I just looked also with no luck, I did send off an inquiry into it from there website.
> > >
> > > I do have plans on testing 8.4-1H1 but just not there yet, but with no plans after that it's a hard sell to management to continue along that path.
> >
> > If it helps, I just took a site running Cache 2012.1.5.956.0.12956 and upgraded from HPE OpenVMS V8.4 to VSI V8.4-1H1. All is still running perfectly and the app users agree!
>
> depends really on management. what are you running for hardware? and what application? any performance improvements? we are on 2015.1 of cache.
>
> Intersystems is checking on the possibility of using 8.4-2. which would help.

If it helps, I just successfully upgraded the site mentioned above (running Cache 2012.1.5) from VSI OpenVMS 8.2-1H1 to VSI OpenVMS V8.4-2L1. Users report the application running just fine.
John.Spitkovsky_at_mscsinc.com
2019-04-09 21:24:02 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Tuesday, April 9, 2019 at 4:14:01 PM UTC-5, John.Spitkovsky_at_mscsinc.com wrote:
> On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 1:37:39 PM UTC-5, ***@gmail.com wrote:
> > On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 2:20:17 PM UTC-4, John.Spitkovsky_at_mscsinc.com wrote:
> > > On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 10:34:31 AM UTC-5, ***@gmail.com wrote:
> > > > On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 11:22:04 AM UTC-4, Stephen Hoffman wrote:
> > > > > On 2019-04-02 14:53:26 +0000, Jim said:
> > > > >
> > > > > > Cache DBMS? Ask again... I believe their plans have changed to include
> > > > > > continued support of VMS.
> > > > >
> > > > > If the InterSystems folks have changed their existing 2017.1 plans,
> > > > > then they're very quiet about it, and haven't clarified nor corrected
> > > > > existing notices:
> > > > > https://community.intersystems.com/post/platform-compatibility-hp-open-vms
> > > > > https://community.intersystems.com/post/vsi-openvms
> > > > > http://blog.intersystems.com/compatibility/
> > > > >
> > > > > --
> > > > > Pure Personal Opinion | HoffmanLabs LLC
> > > >
> > > > I just looked also with no luck, I did send off an inquiry into it from there website.
> > > >
> > > > I do have plans on testing 8.4-1H1 but just not there yet, but with no plans after that it's a hard sell to management to continue along that path.
> > >
> > > If it helps, I just took a site running Cache 2012.1.5.956.0.12956 and upgraded from HPE OpenVMS V8.4 to VSI V8.4-1H1. All is still running perfectly and the app users agree!
> >
> > depends really on management. what are you running for hardware? and what application? any performance improvements? we are on 2015.1 of cache.
> >
> > Intersystems is checking on the possibility of using 8.4-2. which would help.
>
> If it helps, I just successfully upgraded the site mentioned above (running Cache 2012.1.5) from VSI OpenVMS 8.2-1H1 to VSI OpenVMS V8.4-2L1. Users report the application running just fine.

(Sorry...typo, that is 8.4-1H1 to 8.4-2L1)
Forster, Michael
2019-04-09 22:53:48 UTC
Reply
Permalink
Interesting and reassuring though what happens when you need to call the application vendor for support and they state that you are on an unsupported configuration? And since you are, even though you have been paying for support, they can't assist.

I won't mention vendors as Paul hasn't and I haven't asked him however as an example in a previous life, we brought good things to life.

You and I are in the same application vendor space at times we both know. Perhaps your testing is not for the vendor I'm thinking?

Michael Forster
Enterprise Storage and IDX Architect | Information Services
Medical College of Wisconsin
O: (414) 955-4967 | ***@mcw.edu

________________________________________
From: Info-vax <info-vax-***@rbnsn.com> on behalf of John.Spitkovsky_at_mscsinc.com via Info-vax <info-***@rbnsn.com>
Sent: Tuesday, April 9, 2019 4:14:00 PM
To: info-***@rbnsn.com
Cc: John.Spitkovsky_at_mscsinc.com
Subject: Re: [Info-vax] Intersystems Caché on VSI OpenVMS?

ATTENTION: This email originated from a sender outside of MCW. Use caution when clicking on links or opening attachments.
________________________________

On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 1:37:39 PM UTC-5, ***@gmail.com wrote:
> On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 2:20:17 PM UTC-4, John.Spitkovsky_at_mscsinc.com wrote:
> > On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 10:34:31 AM UTC-5, ***@gmail.com wrote:
> > > On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 11:22:04 AM UTC-4, Stephen Hoffman wrote:
> > > > On 2019-04-02 14:53:26 +0000, Jim said:
> > > >
> > > > > Cache DBMS? Ask again... I believe their plans have changed to include
> > > > > continued support of VMS.
> > > >
> > > > If the InterSystems folks have changed their existing 2017.1 plans,
> > > > then they're very quiet about it, and haven't clarified nor corrected
> > > > existing notices:
> > > > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__community.intersystems.com_post_platform-2Dcompatibility-2Dhp-2Dopen-2Dvms&d=DwICAg&c=aFamLAsxMIDYjNglYHTMV0iqFn3z4pVFYPQkjgspw4Y&r=2i3Iy38OaXCqI2PNgrM4Aw&m=AehY5g3x5drRJSPpgD-1yglr_qSTntpvnuiqcjxaESE&s=O4MuyiyqBMJXfYlOBHaQPDXkRd9OX3VAV2IoOmC85FM&e=
> > > > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__community.intersystems.com_post_vsi-2Dopenvms&d=DwICAg&c=aFamLAsxMIDYjNglYHTMV0iqFn3z4pVFYPQkjgspw4Y&r=2i3Iy38OaXCqI2PNgrM4Aw&m=AehY5g3x5drRJSPpgD-1yglr_qSTntpvnuiqcjxaESE&s=6-vTCCat66srYPMwP-6YI4_ecrAqSEwxjX5levLQW2w&e=
> > > > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__blog.intersystems.com_compatibility_&d=DwICAg&c=aFamLAsxMIDYjNglYHTMV0iqFn3z4pVFYPQkjgspw4Y&r=2i3Iy38OaXCqI2PNgrM4Aw&m=AehY5g3x5drRJSPpgD-1yglr_qSTntpvnuiqcjxaESE&s=PFZOcFnD82MQHqRvZwhujNJM-GfpLbrIxktm_NNz_RQ&e=
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Pure Personal Opinion | HoffmanLabs LLC
> > >
> > > I just looked also with no luck, I did send off an inquiry into it from there website.
> > >
> > > I do have plans on testing 8.4-1H1 but just not there yet, but with no plans after that it's a hard sell to management to continue along that path.
> >
> > If it helps, I just took a site running Cache 2012.1.5.956.0.12956 and upgraded from HPE OpenVMS V8.4 to VSI V8.4-1H1. All is still running perfectly and the app users agree!
>
> depends really on management. what are you running for hardware? and what application? any performance improvements? we are on 2015.1 of cache.
>
> Intersystems is checking on the possibility of using 8.4-2. which would help.

If it helps, I just successfully upgraded the site mentioned above (running Cache 2012.1.5) from VSI OpenVMS 8.2-1H1 to VSI OpenVMS V8.4-2L1. Users report the application running just fine.
p***@gmail.com
2019-04-10 13:05:15 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Tuesday, April 9, 2019 at 6:55:04 PM UTC-4, Forster, Michael wrote:
> Interesting and reassuring though what happens when you need to call the application vendor for support and they state that you are on an unsupported configuration? And since you are, even though you have been paying for support, they can't assist.
>
> I won't mention vendors as Paul hasn't and I haven't asked him however as an example in a previous life, we brought good things to life.
>
> You and I are in the same application vendor space at times we both know. Perhaps your testing is not for the vendor I'm thinking?
>
> Michael Forster
> Enterprise Storage and IDX Architect | Information Services
> Medical College of Wisconsin
> O: (414) 955-4967 | ***@mcw.edu
>
> ________________________________________
> From: Info-vax <info-vax-***@rbnsn.com> on behalf of John.Spitkovsky_at_mscsinc.com via Info-vax <info-***@rbnsn.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, April 9, 2019 4:14:00 PM
> To: info-***@rbnsn.com
> Cc: John.Spitkovsky_at_mscsinc.com
> Subject: Re: [Info-vax] Intersystems Caché on VSI OpenVMS?
>
> ATTENTION: This email originated from a sender outside of MCW. Use caution when clicking on links or opening attachments.
> ________________________________
>
> On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 1:37:39 PM UTC-5, ***@gmail.com wrote:
> > On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 2:20:17 PM UTC-4, John.Spitkovsky_at_mscsinc.com wrote:
> > > On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 10:34:31 AM UTC-5, ***@gmail.com wrote:
> > > > On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 11:22:04 AM UTC-4, Stephen Hoffman wrote:
> > > > > On 2019-04-02 14:53:26 +0000, Jim said:
> > > > >
> > > > > > Cache DBMS? Ask again... I believe their plans have changed to include
> > > > > > continued support of VMS.
> > > > >
> > > > > If the InterSystems folks have changed their existing 2017.1 plans,
> > > > > then they're very quiet about it, and haven't clarified nor corrected
> > > > > existing notices:
> > > > > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__community.intersystems.com_post_platform-2Dcompatibility-2Dhp-2Dopen-2Dvms&d=DwICAg&c=aFamLAsxMIDYjNglYHTMV0iqFn3z4pVFYPQkjgspw4Y&r=2i3Iy38OaXCqI2PNgrM4Aw&m=AehY5g3x5drRJSPpgD-1yglr_qSTntpvnuiqcjxaESE&s=O4MuyiyqBMJXfYlOBHaQPDXkRd9OX3VAV2IoOmC85FM&e=
> > > > > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__community.intersystems.com_post_vsi-2Dopenvms&d=DwICAg&c=aFamLAsxMIDYjNglYHTMV0iqFn3z4pVFYPQkjgspw4Y&r=2i3Iy38OaXCqI2PNgrM4Aw&m=AehY5g3x5drRJSPpgD-1yglr_qSTntpvnuiqcjxaESE&s=6-vTCCat66srYPMwP-6YI4_ecrAqSEwxjX5levLQW2w&e=
> > > > > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__blog.intersystems.com_compatibility_&d=DwICAg&c=aFamLAsxMIDYjNglYHTMV0iqFn3z4pVFYPQkjgspw4Y&r=2i3Iy38OaXCqI2PNgrM4Aw&m=AehY5g3x5drRJSPpgD-1yglr_qSTntpvnuiqcjxaESE&s=PFZOcFnD82MQHqRvZwhujNJM-GfpLbrIxktm_NNz_RQ&e=
> > > > >
> > > > > --
> > > > > Pure Personal Opinion | HoffmanLabs LLC
> > > >
> > > > I just looked also with no luck, I did send off an inquiry into it from there website.
> > > >
> > > > I do have plans on testing 8.4-1H1 but just not there yet, but with no plans after that it's a hard sell to management to continue along that path.
> > >
> > > If it helps, I just took a site running Cache 2012.1.5.956.0.12956 and upgraded from HPE OpenVMS V8.4 to VSI V8.4-1H1. All is still running perfectly and the app users agree!
> >
> > depends really on management. what are you running for hardware? and what application? any performance improvements? we are on 2015.1 of cache.
> >
> > Intersystems is checking on the possibility of using 8.4-2. which would help.
>
> If it helps, I just successfully upgraded the site mentioned above (running Cache 2012.1.5) from VSI OpenVMS 8.2-1H1 to VSI OpenVMS V8.4-2L1. Users report the application running just fine.
> _______________________________________________
> Info-vax mailing list
> Info-***@rbnsn.com
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__rbnsn.com_mailman_listinfo_info-2Dvax-5Frbnsn.com&d=DwICAg&c=aFamLAsxMIDYjNglYHTMV0iqFn3z4pVFYPQkjgspw4Y&r=2i3Iy38OaXCqI2PNgrM4Aw&m=AehY5g3x5drRJSPpgD-1yglr_qSTntpvnuiqcjxaESE&s=_5TYjXf1zfYs4rF-B5EuWAG3Bd-JZ38UGO2EYNHTGGI&e=

Michael that too is my question. John what are your plans if you need support going forward? knowing you have nothing coming from Intersystems? that seems like a huge risk, I wouldn't want, especially when the company you work for relies on that for their whole business. I'm glad it's working, do you have Intersystems mirroring?

pc
John.Spitkovsky_at_mscsinc.com
2019-04-10 13:27:31 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Wednesday, April 10, 2019 at 8:05:17 AM UTC-5, ***@gmail.com wrote:
> On Tuesday, April 9, 2019 at 6:55:04 PM UTC-4, Forster, Michael wrote:
> > Interesting and reassuring though what happens when you need to call the application vendor for support and they state that you are on an unsupported configuration? And since you are, even though you have been paying for support, they can't assist.
> >
> > I won't mention vendors as Paul hasn't and I haven't asked him however as an example in a previous life, we brought good things to life.
> >
> > You and I are in the same application vendor space at times we both know. Perhaps your testing is not for the vendor I'm thinking?
> >
> > Michael Forster
> > Enterprise Storage and IDX Architect | Information Services
> > Medical College of Wisconsin
> >
> > ________________________________________
> > From: Info-vax <info-vax-***@rbnsn.com> on behalf of John.Spitkovsky_at_mscsinc.com via Info-vax <info-***@rb...com>
> > Sent: Tuesday, April 9, 2019 4:14:00 PM
> > To: info-***@rb...com
> > Cc: John.Spitkovsky_at_mscsinc.com
> > Subject: Re: [Info-vax] Intersystems Caché on VSI OpenVMS?
> >
> > ATTENTION: This email originated from a sender outside of MCW. Use caution when clicking on links or opening attachments.
> > ________________________________
> >
> > On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 1:37:39 PM UTC-5, ***@gmail.com wrote:
> > > On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 2:20:17 PM UTC-4, John.Spitkovsky_at_mscsinc.com wrote:
> > > > On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 10:34:31 AM UTC-5, ***@gmail.com wrote:
> > > > > On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 11:22:04 AM UTC-4, Stephen Hoffman wrote:
> > > > > > On 2019-04-02 14:53:26 +0000, Jim said:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > Cache DBMS? Ask again... I believe their plans have changed to include
> > > > > > > continued support of VMS.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > If the InterSystems folks have changed their existing 2017.1 plans,
> > > > > > then they're very quiet about it, and haven't clarified nor corrected
> > > > > > existing notices:

> > > > > >
> > > > > > --
> > > > > > Pure Personal Opinion | HoffmanLabs LLC
> > > > >
> > > > > I just looked also with no luck, I did send off an inquiry into it from there website.
> > > > >
> > > > > I do have plans on testing 8.4-1H1 but just not there yet, but with no plans after that it's a hard sell to management to continue along that path.
> > > >
> > > > If it helps, I just took a site running Cache 2012.1.5.956.0.12956 and upgraded from HPE OpenVMS V8.4 to VSI V8.4-1H1. All is still running perfectly and the app users agree!
> > >
> > > depends really on management. what are you running for hardware? and what application? any performance improvements? we are on 2015.1 of cache.
> > >
> > > Intersystems is checking on the possibility of using 8.4-2. which would help.
> >
> > If it helps, I just successfully upgraded the site mentioned above (running Cache 2012.1.5) from VSI OpenVMS 8.2-1H1 to VSI OpenVMS V8.4-2L1. Users report the application running just fine.
> > _______________________________________________

>
> Michael that too is my question. John what are your plans if you need support going forward? knowing you have nothing coming from Intersystems? that seems like a huge risk, I wouldn't want, especially when the company you work for relies on that for their whole business. I'm glad it's working, do you have Intersystems mirroring?
>
> pc

That's certainly reasonable in most cases. In my particular case, unless we switch operating systems, the current software pieces will be unsupported by the application vendor(s) after 2020 no matter what we do. At least this gets a piece of the environment, the OS, into a supportable state.

And no, we do not do DB mirroring.

I understand this has to be a case-by-case decision for everyone, and there are a lot of factors to consider, but in my case, my hands are tied by other people for many of these decisions. The best I can do is make my little part better. If it helps other people to know one environment where it works, I have accomplished my goal here. :-)
p***@gmail.com
2021-01-06 14:26:16 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Wednesday, April 10, 2019 at 9:27:32 AM UTC-4, John.Spitkovsky_at_mscsinc.com wrote:
> On Wednesday, April 10, 2019 at 8:05:17 AM UTC-5, ***@gmail.com wrote:
> > On Tuesday, April 9, 2019 at 6:55:04 PM UTC-4, Forster, Michael wrote:
> > > Interesting and reassuring though what happens when you need to call the application vendor for support and they state that you are on an unsupported configuration? And since you are, even though you have been paying for support, they can't assist.
> > >
> > > I won't mention vendors as Paul hasn't and I haven't asked him however as an example in a previous life, we brought good things to life.
> > >
> > > You and I are in the same application vendor space at times we both know. Perhaps your testing is not for the vendor I'm thinking?
> > >
> > > Michael Forster
> > > Enterprise Storage and IDX Architect | Information Services
> > > Medical College of Wisconsin
> > >
> > > ________________________________________
> > > From: Info-vax <info-***@rbnsn.com> on behalf of John.Spitkovsky_at_mscsinc.com via Info-vax <info-***@rb...com>
> > > Sent: Tuesday, April 9, 2019 4:14:00 PM
> > > To: info-***@rb...com
> > > Cc: John.Spitkovsky_at_mscsinc.com
> > > Subject: Re: [Info-vax] Intersystems Caché on VSI OpenVMS?
> > >
> > > ATTENTION: This email originated from a sender outside of MCW. Use caution when clicking on links or opening attachments.
> > > ________________________________
> > >
> > > On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 1:37:39 PM UTC-5, ***@gmail.com wrote:
> > > > On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 2:20:17 PM UTC-4, John.Spitkovsky_at_mscsinc.com wrote:
> > > > > On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 10:34:31 AM UTC-5, ***@gmail.com wrote:
> > > > > > On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 11:22:04 AM UTC-4, Stephen Hoffman wrote:
> > > > > > > On 2019-04-02 14:53:26 +0000, Jim said:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > Cache DBMS? Ask again... I believe their plans have changed to include
> > > > > > > > continued support of VMS.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > If the InterSystems folks have changed their existing 2017.1 plans,
> > > > > > > then they're very quiet about it, and haven't clarified nor corrected
> > > > > > > existing notices:
>
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > --
> > > > > > > Pure Personal Opinion | HoffmanLabs LLC
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I just looked also with no luck, I did send off an inquiry into it from there website.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I do have plans on testing 8.4-1H1 but just not there yet, but with no plans after that it's a hard sell to management to continue along that path.
> > > > >
> > > > > If it helps, I just took a site running Cache 2012.1.5.956.0.12956 and upgraded from HPE OpenVMS V8.4 to VSI V8.4-1H1. All is still running perfectly and the app users agree!
> > > >
> > > > depends really on management. what are you running for hardware? and what application? any performance improvements? we are on 2015.1 of cache.
> > > >
> > > > Intersystems is checking on the possibility of using 8.4-2. which would help.
> > >
> > > If it helps, I just successfully upgraded the site mentioned above (running Cache 2012.1.5) from VSI OpenVMS 8.2-1H1 to VSI OpenVMS V8.4-2L1. Users report the application running just fine.
> > > _______________________________________________
>
> >
> > Michael that too is my question. John what are your plans if you need support going forward? knowing you have nothing coming from Intersystems? that seems like a huge risk, I wouldn't want, especially when the company you work for relies on that for their whole business. I'm glad it's working, do you have Intersystems mirroring?
> >
> > pc
> That's certainly reasonable in most cases. In my particular case, unless we switch operating systems, the current software pieces will be unsupported by the application vendor(s) after 2020 no matter what we do. At least this gets a piece of the environment, the OS, into a supportable state.
>
> And no, we do not do DB mirroring.
>
> I understand this has to be a case-by-case decision for everyone, and there are a lot of factors to consider, but in my case, my hands are tied by other people for many of these decisions. The best I can do is make my little part better. If it helps other people to know one environment where it works, I have accomplished my goal here. :-)

since it's been awhile...
I thought I would check in and see if you were still having no issues? or was there anything you ran into?

thanks
Bill Gunshannon
2019-04-02 17:03:42 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On 4/2/19 11:22 AM, Stephen Hoffman wrote:
> On 2019-04-02 14:53:26 +0000, Jim said:
>
>> Cache DBMS? Ask again... I believe their plans have changed to include
>> continued support of VMS.
>
> If the InterSystems folks have changed their existing 2017.1 plans, then
> they're very quiet about it, and haven't clarified nor corrected
> existing notices:
> https://community.intersystems.com/post/platform-compatibility-hp-open-vms
> https://community.intersystems.com/post/vsi-openvms
> http://blog.intersystems.com/compatibility/
>


Well, that's good news, I guess. But how many people have looked
at what their world facing webpage says and made the same assumption
I made that VMS support was on the way out?

bill
p***@gmail.com
2019-04-02 17:20:26 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On Tuesday, April 2, 2019 at 1:03:46 PM UTC-4, Bill Gunshannon wrote:
> On 4/2/19 11:22 AM, Stephen Hoffman wrote:
> > On 2019-04-02 14:53:26 +0000, Jim said:
> >
> >> Cache DBMS? Ask again... I believe their plans have changed to include
> >> continued support of VMS.
> >
> > If the InterSystems folks have changed their existing 2017.1 plans, then
> > they're very quiet about it, and haven't clarified nor corrected
> > existing notices:
> > https://community.intersystems.com/post/platform-compatibility-hp-open-vms
> > https://community.intersystems.com/post/vsi-openvms
> > http://blog.intersystems.com/compatibility/
> >
>
>
> Well, that's good news, I guess. But how many people have looked
> at what their world facing webpage says and made the same assumption
> I made that VMS support was on the way out?
>
> bill

ok please share where they say it isn't on the way out. the last version of vms is 8.4-1h1 on 2017.1 nothing for vms after that or any other version of cache.
https://docs.intersystems.com/documentation/ISP/ISP-20171/ISP_technologies.html#ISP_platforms_server
Bill Gunshannon
2019-04-02 16:59:57 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On 4/2/19 10:53 AM, Jim wrote:
>>
>> Well, that begets 2 questions. that's 3 though! :-)
>>
>> What is stopping the app vendor from supporting their app on VSI VMS
>> V8.4 2L? would have to ask Intersystems
>>
>
> Cache DBMS? Ask again... I believe their plans have changed to include
> continued support of VMS.
>


Not according to their current webpage.

bill
Bill Gunshannon
2019-04-02 16:59:21 UTC
Reply
Permalink
On 4/2/19 10:45 AM, ***@gmail.com wrote:
> On Monday, April 1, 2019 at 5:39:37 PM UTC-4, Dave Froble wrote:
>> On 4/1/2019 4:40 PM, ***@gmail.com wrote:
>>> On Monday, April 1, 2019 at 4:30:38 PM UTC-4, Robert A. Brooks wrote:
>>>> On 4/1/2019 4:16 PM, ***@gmail.com wrote:
>>>>> On Monday, April 1, 2019 at 4:13:18 PM UTC-4, Jan-Erik Söderholm
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> Den 2019-04-01 kl. 22:07, skrev Robert A. Brooks:
>>>>>>> On 4/1/2019 3:43 PM, ***@gmail.com wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Monday, April 1, 2019 at 5:25:58 AM UTC-4, Ian Miller
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Existing contracts for OpenVMS software support with HPE
>>>>>>>>> will continue as they do now. Renewals will have to be
>>>>>>>>> carefully thought about. New contracts should go to VSI.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I was told they are no longer selling their own licenses
>>>>>>>> either. if you want an add on product you're SOL too...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> What "add-on" product are you talking about that VSI cannot
>>>>>>> provide (hence the "SOL" comment)?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I think "they" refered to HPE and an VSI "add-on" would not work
>>>>>> together with an "HPE VMS" system, does it? You then need to do a
>>>>>> full HPE to VSI transition of your licenses, not?
>>>>>
>>>>> no an HPE product! I was interested in a 'C' license for 8.4 and was
>>>>> told they were not selling anymore licensing for HPE VMS.
>>>>
>>>> The point of my comment was that while it may be a bit of a pain
>>>> to change your VMS provider from HPE to VSI, we are here and are happy
>>>> to sell stuff, including C licenses, such that you are not SOL.
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>>
>>>> -- Rob
>>>
>>> I'm already a VSI support customer. still running 8.4 unfortunately for now due to app vendor mostly.
>>>
>>
>> Well, that begets 2 questions.
>>
>> What is stopping the app vendor from supporting their app on VSI VMS
>> V8.4 2L?
>>
>> Will the VSI C compiler not work on your HPE VMS V8.4 system?
>>
>> Got a spare system you can run the VSI OS on? I'd be rather surprised
>> if the obj file would not be transferable between systems.
>>
>> --
>> David Froble Tel: 724-529-0450
>> Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc. E-Mail: ***@tsoft-inc.com
>> DFE Ultralights, Inc.
>> 170 Grimplin Road
>> Vanderbilt, PA 15486
>
> Well, that begets 2 questions. that's 3 though! :-)
>
> What is stopping the app vendor from supporting their app on VSI VMS
> V8.4 2L? would have to ask Intersystems
>

Or just go to their website.

------------------

HP OpenVMS for Alpha*
HP OpenVMS for Itanium*

* No additional releases are planned for this platform.

---------------------

Kinda looks like another vendor dropping VMS.

bill
Loading...