Discussion:
interconnect nodes
(too old to reply)
Edgar Ulloa
2020-11-24 22:38:48 UTC
Permalink
I have this scenario
3 ovms 8.4 nodes each in a city
node B communicates well with A and C
nodes a and c there is no communication between them.
If I have no way to intercommunicate them via routers or physical gategays,
is there any way to make them communicate with each other using node b as if it were a gateway?
the communication will be sftp ssh telnet
this can?
any ideas?
Stephen Hoffman
2020-11-24 23:38:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by Edgar Ulloa
I have this scenario
3 ovms 8.4 nodes each in a city
node B communicates well with A and C
nodes a and c there is no communication between them.
If I have no way to intercommunicate them via routers or physical gategays,
is there any way to make them communicate with each other using node b
as if it were a gateway?
the communication will be sftp ssh telnet
this can?
any ideas?
If you're referring to clustering and not networking...



SCS does not support nor implement SCS routing.

Each cluster member host needs a direct path to every other host within
a cluster.

This is the so-called rule of total connectivity,

Cluster communications are available via select point-to-point or
multi-point links (e.g. DSSI, CI), via LAN, or via bridged LAN, or via
SCS over IP, or a mixture.

Cluster communications links must officially be a minimum of slow
Ethernet (10Mbps) speed, but links that glacial are badly prone to
congestion stalls.

For this cluster configuration...

If a cluster connection from "A" to "C" via "B" is unavailable, "A" and
"C" will detect the cluster partitioning and will stall pending manual
recovery.

You'll either need a link from "A" to "C" that does not pass through
"B"—whether SCS via IP or otherwise—for this to work when the "B" site
tips over.

Or you'll want to downgrade "A" or "C" to a non-clustered
configuration, and relocate periodic backups or otherwise replicate
data to the downgraded site.



If you're referring to IP networking and not clustering...


Your link choices are much wider than with clustering, but you'll still
need local internet connections or dedicated links around the "B" site
for redundancy.

But if you're not interested in link redundancy, then it is
possible—awkward, clumsy, expensive—to set up OpenVMS as either a
DECnet router or an IP router.

With IP and with no interest in link redundancy, it'd be fairly typical
to have "A", "B", and "C" in separate IP subnets, and then install a
(cheap) router at "B", and off you go.

OpenVMS—pretty much any server—makes a rotten IP router. Or DECnet
router, for that matter.

If you're centrally asking how to set up OpenVMS as an (awkward) IP
router, check the docs for whichever IP stack you're using.

Though far more typically, existing IP network links provide this
configuration without using the OpenVMS host at "B" site as a router.
--
Pure Personal Opinion | HoffmanLabs LLC
Edgar Ulloa
2020-11-25 13:30:04 UTC
Permalink
Post by Stephen Hoffman
Post by Edgar Ulloa
I have this scenario
3 ovms 8.4 nodes each in a city
node B communicates well with A and C
nodes a and c there is no communication between them.
If I have no way to intercommunicate them via routers or physical gategays,
is there any way to make them communicate with each other using node b
as if it were a gateway?
the communication will be sftp ssh telnet
this can?
any ideas?
If you're referring to clustering and not networking...
SCS does not support nor implement SCS routing.
Each cluster member host needs a direct path to every other host within
a cluster.
This is the so-called rule of total connectivity,
Cluster communications are available via select point-to-point or
multi-point links (e.g. DSSI, CI), via LAN, or via bridged LAN, or via
SCS over IP, or a mixture.
Cluster communications links must officially be a minimum of slow
Ethernet (10Mbps) speed, but links that glacial are badly prone to
congestion stalls.
For this cluster configuration...
If a cluster connection from "A" to "C" via "B" is unavailable, "A" and
"C" will detect the cluster partitioning and will stall pending manual
recovery.
You'll either need a link from "A" to "C" that does not pass through
"B"—whether SCS via IP or otherwise—for this to work when the "B" site
tips over.
Or you'll want to downgrade "A" or "C" to a non-clustered
configuration, and relocate periodic backups or otherwise replicate
data to the downgraded site.
If you're referring to IP networking and not clustering...
Your link choices are much wider than with clustering, but you'll still
need local internet connections or dedicated links around the "B" site
for redundancy.
But if you're not interested in link redundancy, then it is
possible—awkward, clumsy, expensive—to set up OpenVMS as either a
DECnet router or an IP router.
With IP and with no interest in link redundancy, it'd be fairly typical
to have "A", "B", and "C" in separate IP subnets, and then install a
(cheap) router at "B", and off you go.
OpenVMS—pretty much any server—makes a rotten IP router. Or DECnet
router, for that matter.
If you're centrally asking how to set up OpenVMS as an (awkward) IP
router, check the docs for whichever IP stack you're using.
Though far more typically, existing IP network links provide this
configuration without using the OpenVMS host at "B" site as a router.
--
Pure Personal Opinion | HoffmanLabs LLC
Thanks Stephen, I'll look for information on how to do this
how to set up OpenVMS as an IP router
thanks ever so much for your time
Cheers
Dave Froble
2020-11-25 00:59:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by Edgar Ulloa
I have this scenario
3 ovms 8.4 nodes each in a city
node B communicates well with A and C
nodes a and c there is no communication between them.
If I have no way to intercommunicate them via routers or physical gategays,
is there any way to make them communicate with each other using node b as if it were a gateway?
the communication will be sftp ssh telnet
this can?
any ideas?
Well, need some details before considering any solutions.

Assuming IP as you've indicated, (SFTP, SSH, and TelNet), all that is
required is ethernet connectivity.

Big question, how does A and C communicate with B?

Assuming that there is ethernet involved, then if A and C are both
plugged into the same network switch (probably doesn't have to be a
single switch, but that's how I'd do it) then they are connected.

I'm guessing it's not that simple, or, you wouldn't be asking here.
--
David Froble Tel: 724-529-0450
Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc. E-Mail: ***@tsoft-inc.com
DFE Ultralights, Inc.
170 Grimplin Road
Vanderbilt, PA 15486
Edgar Ulloa
2020-11-25 13:22:38 UTC
Permalink
Post by Dave Froble
Post by Edgar Ulloa
I have this scenario
3 ovms 8.4 nodes each in a city
node B communicates well with A and C
nodes a and c there is no communication between them.
If I have no way to intercommunicate them via routers or physical gategays,
is there any way to make them communicate with each other using node b as if it were a gateway?
the communication will be sftp ssh telnet
this can?
any ideas?
Well, need some details before considering any solutions.
Assuming IP as you've indicated, (SFTP, SSH, and TelNet), all that is
required is ethernet connectivity.
Big question, how does A and C communicate with B?
Assuming that there is ethernet involved, then if A and C are both
plugged into the same network switch (probably doesn't have to be a
single switch, but that's how I'd do it) then they are connected.
I'm guessing it's not that simple, or, you wouldn't be asking here.
--
David Froble Tel: 724-529-0450
DFE Ultralights, Inc.
170 Grimplin Road
Vanderbilt, PA 15486
Hi Dave

each node is stand alone and will not be a cluster
the way to access is just telnet and a little router between Node A to B and another B to C

From node B I get access to each city without problem
but node A and node C there is no ping between them and for now there is no budget to invest in telecommunications.

It occurred to me that I could communicate Node A with Node C using B as a gateway.
Even try to put a route $ set route xxxx,. / Gateway = nodeb but not work.

Much appreciated all for the time
Stephen Hoffman
2020-11-25 16:13:24 UTC
Permalink
From node B I get access to each city without problem but node A and
node C there is no ping between them and for now there is no budget to
invest in telecommunications.
...
So basically you want help setting up IP networking on an OpenVMS host,
and with little or no management and networking group support. That's
going to work well.

But I suspect you're bumping into a VLAN configuration limit. If your
network group isn't actively hostile, have them look at the IP routing,
VLAN, and subnet configuration here.
--
Pure Personal Opinion | HoffmanLabs LLC
Jim
2020-11-25 13:41:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by Edgar Ulloa
I have this scenario
3 ovms 8.4 nodes each in a city
node B communicates well with A and C
nodes a and c there is no communication between them.
If I have no way to intercommunicate them via routers or physical gategays,
is there any way to make them communicate with each other using node b as if it were a gateway?
the communication will be sftp ssh telnet
this can?
any ideas?
I've not ever had occasion to use a VMS system as a TCP router so this is not from experience,
but, I'd expect that you'd need to enable the GATED routing protocol on node B and probably RIP
on all three hosts. There will be some configuration of GATED where you'd define the routes to
node A and C. I think both MultiNet and VMS' TCPIP support such.
Jim
2020-11-25 14:04:26 UTC
Permalink
I've not ever had occasion to use a VMS system as a IP router so this is not from experience,
but, I'd expect that you'd need to enable the GATED routing protocol on node B and probably RIP
on all three hosts. There will be some configuration of GATED where you'd define the routes to
node A and C. I think both MultiNet and VMS' TCPIP support such.
See the MultiNet documentation for this as it has an example ("Sample GATED Configurations")
near the end of the current Installation and Administrator's Guide chapter on "Configuring Network
Routing" that parallels what you're describing - see bottom of chapter 10 here:

http://www.process.com/docs/multinet5_5/install_admin/chapter_10.html.
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