Discussion:
HP Away
(too old to reply)
Fabio Cardoso
2004-08-17 16:19:33 UTC
Permalink
Click

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/08/17/sun_hpaway_phasethree/


HP's Unix base offered Opteron carrot

"HP World Sun Microsystems has started Phase III of its HP Away
program for shifting customers off the Tru64 and HP-UX operating
systems and onto Solaris.

This time round Sun has centered its attack on a new fleet of Opteron
servers, which were finally delivered in July, instead of its
traditional UltraSPARC-based gear. As in the past, Sun offers up free
consulting services to HP customers to demonstrate how much a move
from Tru64 or HP-UX will cost and how well applications will perform
on Solaris. Over the past year, Sun has pulled 150 customers from HP,
resulting in close to $200m in revenue.

"We were focused on moving customers from RISC to RISC before, but now
that we have these Opteron systems, we decided to offer a move from HP
RISC platforms to x86 as well," said Larry Singer, Sun's head of
global market strategies.

One positive with the new Opteron program is that HP customers are
being given a path from traditionally more expensive Alpha- and
PA-RISC-based servers to lower-cost x86 gear.

^
|------- HP: Look at this paragraph !!!


Sun offers workstations, a two processor box and a four processor box
based on AMD's x86-64-bit Opteron chip. Sun is familiar with this
shift from RISC to x86, as it has seen a number of its key customers,
particularly those in the financial services markets, move from
Solaris/SPARC kit to Linux on Intel.

These days, however, Sun's renewed interest in Solaris x86 has it
asking HP's customer base to make an easier Unix to Unix shift and
just replace the processor underneath the OS. But with only up to a
four-processor Opteron system available, Sun won't be able to tempt
HP's higher-end Unix customers to make this move. In addition, Sun has
yet to complete a 64-bit version of Solaris for Opteron. HP customers
would need to be running 32-bit software or wait until December to get
the 64-bit OS.

Sun, of course, started this HP Away program to attract Alpha and
PA-RISC customers that are being forced to move onto Intel's 64-bit
Itanium processor, as HP pulls out of the processor-making game.
(...)"
Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy
2004-08-17 16:36:39 UTC
Permalink
Post by Fabio Cardoso
Click
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/08/17/sun_hpaway_phasethree/
PA-RISC-based servers to lower-cost x86 gear.
^
|------- HP: Look at this paragraph !!!
Sun offers workstations, a two processor box and a four processor box
based on AMD's x86-64-bit Opteron chip. Sun is familiar with this
shift from RISC to x86, as it has seen a number of its key customers,
particularly those in the financial services markets, move from
Solaris/SPARC kit to Linux on Intel.
These days, however, Sun's renewed interest in Solaris x86 has it
asking HP's customer base to make an easier Unix to Unix shift and
just replace the processor underneath the OS. But with only up to a
four-processor Opteron system available, Sun won't be able to tempt
HP's higher-end Unix customers to make this move. In addition, Sun has
yet to complete a 64-bit version of Solaris for Opteron. HP customers
would need to be running 32-bit software or wait until December to get
the 64-bit OS.
Full AMD64 support arrives in Solaris 10 which itself has a whole
load of tempting goodies designed to lure the wavering HP-UX, Tru64
customer away such as ZFS, Dtrace and Zones plus a lot more.

Su is also doing an 8 way Opteron box though this isn't out yet
and when AMD goes dual core this will in effect double, that
eats a long way into HP's current installed base.

Regards
Andrew Harrison
Post by Fabio Cardoso
Sun, of course, started this HP Away program to attract Alpha and
PA-RISC customers that are being forced to move onto Intel's 64-bit
Itanium processor, as HP pulls out of the processor-making game.
(...)"
Bob Ceculski
2004-08-17 23:31:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy
Full AMD64 support arrives in Solaris 10 which itself has a whole
load of tempting goodies designed to lure the wavering HP-UX, Tru64
customer away such as ZFS, Dtrace and Zones plus a lot more.
Su is also doing an 8 way Opteron box though this isn't out yet
and when AMD goes dual core this will in effect double, that
eats a long way into HP's current installed base.
Regards
Andrew Harrison
Post by Fabio Cardoso
Sun, of course, started this HP Away program to attract Alpha and
PA-RISC customers that are being forced to move onto Intel's 64-bit
Itanium processor, as HP pulls out of the processor-making game.
(...)"
unfortunately, there are no secure, clustered solutions like
OpenVMS on these boxes, which makes them worthless ...
Andrew Harrison
2004-08-18 13:02:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bob Ceculski
Post by Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy
Full AMD64 support arrives in Solaris 10 which itself has a whole
load of tempting goodies designed to lure the wavering HP-UX, Tru64
customer away such as ZFS, Dtrace and Zones plus a lot more.
Su is also doing an 8 way Opteron box though this isn't out yet
and when AMD goes dual core this will in effect double, that
eats a long way into HP's current installed base.
Regards
Andrew Harrison
Post by Fabio Cardoso
Sun, of course, started this HP Away program to attract Alpha and
PA-RISC customers that are being forced to move onto Intel's 64-bit
Itanium processor, as HP pulls out of the processor-making game.
(...)"
unfortunately, there are no secure, clustered solutions like
OpenVMS on these boxes, which makes them worthless ...
Depends what you want Bob, there is no point in getting into
a security pissing competition between OpenVMS and Solaris
because you will only bring up Defcon 9 and CERT and lose by
default.

However Solaris is rather more secure than you think and much
more secure than Windows or Linux.

There is also not point in getting into a cluster pissing competition
with you, you have demonstrated a complete lack of knowledge about
UNIX/Solaris clustering in the past so its a discussion you are
also never going to win.

And again Solaris clustering is good enough for most customers and
has considerably more capability than you think (again) like a
cluster filesystem for example. That coupled with things like JES
application clustering using Clustra and you have a very strong
story in terms of availability.

And there are areas where Solaris is considerably more functional
than OpenVMS most of the key upcoming features in Solaris 10 like
dtrace and ZFS are a long long way ahead of anything on offer in
OpenVMS.

This is before you consider platform choice and probably the killer
availability of third party applications.

Regards
Andrew Harrison
Bill Todd
2004-08-18 16:30:49 UTC
Permalink
"Andrew Harrison" <***@su_n.com> wrote in message news:cfvk0k$10f$***@new-usenet.uk.sun.com...

...
Post by Andrew Harrison
And there are areas where Solaris is considerably more functional
than OpenVMS most of the key upcoming features in Solaris 10 like
dtrace and ZFS are a long long way ahead of anything on offer in
OpenVMS.
Well, if more information were available about ZFS, we'd at least have some
basis for evaluating that assertion. So if any new public papers have
emerged, pointers to them would be nice.

- bill
Andrew Harrison
2004-08-19 16:16:15 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bill Todd
...
Post by Andrew Harrison
And there are areas where Solaris is considerably more functional
than OpenVMS most of the key upcoming features in Solaris 10 like
dtrace and ZFS are a long long way ahead of anything on offer in
OpenVMS.
Well, if more information were available about ZFS, we'd at least have some
basis for evaluating that assertion. So if any new public papers have
emerged, pointers to them would be nice.
- bill
I don't remember if I sent this reference out before if I did
my apologies.

http://tesla.hpl.hp.com/self-manage03/Finals/henson-self-tune.pdf

DFS aka ZFS will be released as part of the Sun Software Express
program later this year, I will send you refs to the documentation
when this happens.

Regards
Andrew Harrison
Bob Ceculski
2004-08-19 23:33:12 UTC
Permalink
Post by Andrew Harrison
I don't remember if I sent this reference out before if I did
my apologies.
http://tesla.hpl.hp.com/self-manage03/Finals/henson-self-tune.pdf
DFS aka ZFS will be released as part of the Sun Software Express
program later this year, I will send you refs to the documentation
when this happens.
Regards
Andrew Harrison
don't bother, because nobody is porting to your garbage
systems and cert of the week club slowaris ...
John Smith
2004-08-20 01:30:14 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bob Ceculski
Post by Andrew Harrison
I don't remember if I sent this reference out before if I did
my apologies.
http://tesla.hpl.hp.com/self-manage03/Finals/henson-self-tune.pdf
DFS aka ZFS will be released as part of the Sun Software Express
program later this year, I will send you refs to the documentation
when this happens.
Regards
Andrew Harrison
don't bother, because nobody is porting to your garbage
systems and cert of the week club slowaris ...
Bob,

Quit blowing so hard. I'm sure Andrew is a perfectly nice guy, aside from
the fact that he works for Sun...but give him a break... he probably has a
mortgage and needs to eat just like the rest of us.

Solaris is perfectly adequate for those who don't know any better. I can see
the new Sun advertising campaign now, "Solaris & Linux. The perfect
combination for all you ignorant 'suits' and IT guys."

The real problem is that HP refuses to educate those who need to know better
CJT
2004-08-20 03:04:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Smith
Post by Bob Ceculski
Post by Andrew Harrison
I don't remember if I sent this reference out before if I did
my apologies.
http://tesla.hpl.hp.com/self-manage03/Finals/henson-self-tune.pdf
DFS aka ZFS will be released as part of the Sun Software Express
program later this year, I will send you refs to the documentation
when this happens.
Regards
Andrew Harrison
don't bother, because nobody is porting to your garbage
systems and cert of the week club slowaris ...
Bob,
Quit blowing so hard. I'm sure Andrew is a perfectly nice guy, aside from
the fact that he works for Sun...but give him a break... he probably has a
mortgage and needs to eat just like the rest of us.
Solaris is perfectly adequate for those who don't know any better. I can see
the new Sun advertising campaign now, "Solaris & Linux. The perfect
combination for all you ignorant 'suits' and IT guys."
The real problem is that HP refuses to educate those who need to know better
I think another real problem is that they showed the wrong people the
door.
--
The e-mail address in our reply-to line is reversed in an attempt to
minimize spam. Our true address is of the form ***@prodigy.net.
David Froble
2004-08-20 17:03:31 UTC
Permalink
Post by CJT
Post by John Smith
Post by Bob Ceculski
Post by Andrew Harrison
I don't remember if I sent this reference out before if I did
my apologies.
http://tesla.hpl.hp.com/self-manage03/Finals/henson-self-tune.pdf
DFS aka ZFS will be released as part of the Sun Software Express
program later this year, I will send you refs to the documentation
when this happens.
Regards
Andrew Harrison
don't bother, because nobody is porting to your garbage
systems and cert of the week club slowaris ...
Bob,
Quit blowing so hard. I'm sure Andrew is a perfectly nice guy, aside from
the fact that he works for Sun...but give him a break... he probably has a
mortgage and needs to eat just like the rest of us.
Solaris is perfectly adequate for those who don't know any better. I can see
the new Sun advertising campaign now, "Solaris & Linux. The perfect
combination for all you ignorant 'suits' and IT guys."
The real problem is that HP refuses to educate those who need to know better
I think another real problem is that they showed the wrong people the
door.
You mean like DEC did? The problem at DEC was that they assigned the job of
cutting the fat to ..... The Fat! Never did find even one who cut his own job.

Dave
--
David Froble Tel: 724-529-0450
Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc. Fax: 724-529-0596
DFE Ultralights, Inc. E-Mail: ***@tsoft-inc.com
170 Grimplin Road
Vanderbilt, PA 15486
Andrew Harrison
2004-08-20 10:19:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bob Ceculski
Post by Andrew Harrison
I don't remember if I sent this reference out before if I did
my apologies.
http://tesla.hpl.hp.com/self-manage03/Finals/henson-self-tune.pdf
DFS aka ZFS will be released as part of the Sun Software Express
program later this year, I will send you refs to the documentation
when this happens.
Regards
Andrew Harrison
ds
don't bother, because nobody is porting to your garbage
systems and cert of the week club slowaris ...
So you don't want to know what the competition can do ?

Actually thats a silly question on my part, its entirely
obvious that understanding what you slag off has never
been high on your agenda. If it had people might take
you a bit more seriously.

Regards
Andrew Harrison
Bob Ceculski
2004-08-19 23:33:37 UTC
Permalink
Post by Andrew Harrison
I don't remember if I sent this reference out before if I did
my apologies.
http://tesla.hpl.hp.com/self-manage03/Finals/henson-self-tune.pdf
DFS aka ZFS will be released as part of the Sun Software Express
program later this year, I will send you refs to the documentation
when this happens.
Regards
Andrew Harrison
don't bother, because nobody is porting to your garbage
systems and cert of the week club slowaris ...
Andrew Harrison
2004-08-20 10:16:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bob Ceculski
Post by Andrew Harrison
I don't remember if I sent this reference out before if I did
my apologies.
http://tesla.hpl.hp.com/self-manage03/Finals/henson-self-tune.pdf
DFS aka ZFS will be released as part of the Sun Software Express
program later this year, I will send you refs to the documentation
when this happens.
Regards
Andrew Harrison
don't bother, because nobody is porting to your garbage
systems and cert of the week club slowaris ...
Is it just me or is the echo getting worse.

Regards
Andrew Harrison
David Froble
2004-08-20 17:06:17 UTC
Permalink
Post by Andrew Harrison
Post by Bob Ceculski
Post by Andrew Harrison
I don't remember if I sent this reference out before if I did
my apologies.
http://tesla.hpl.hp.com/self-manage03/Finals/henson-self-tune.pdf
DFS aka ZFS will be released as part of the Sun Software Express
program later this year, I will send you refs to the documentation
when this happens.
Regards
Andrew Harrison
don't bother, because nobody is porting to your garbage
systems and cert of the week club slowaris ...
Is it just me or is the echo getting worse.
Regards
Andrew Harrison
As I mentioned earlier, we must be getting boob so riled up that he's mashing
the send button hard enough to defeat the anti-bounce features. :-)
--
David Froble Tel: 724-529-0450
Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc. Fax: 724-529-0596
DFE Ultralights, Inc. E-Mail: ***@tsoft-inc.com
170 Grimplin Road
Vanderbilt, PA 15486
David Froble
2004-08-18 15:09:23 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bob Ceculski
Post by Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy
Full AMD64 support arrives in Solaris 10 which itself has a whole
load of tempting goodies designed to lure the wavering HP-UX, Tru64
customer away such as ZFS, Dtrace and Zones plus a lot more.
Su is also doing an 8 way Opteron box though this isn't out yet
and when AMD goes dual core this will in effect double, that
eats a long way into HP's current installed base.
Regards
Andrew Harrison
Post by Fabio Cardoso
Sun, of course, started this HP Away program to attract Alpha and
PA-RISC customers that are being forced to move onto Intel's 64-bit
Itanium processor, as HP pulls out of the processor-making game.
(...)"
unfortunately, there are no secure, clustered solutions like
OpenVMS on these boxes, which makes them worthless ...
Well, if you're already on a 'boob defined' unsecure, non-clustered, worthless
environment, you won't be losing anything, and you'll avoid the itanic and the
boobs that have tried to force it down your throat.

You'll also be with a company that appears (however forced) to offer multiple
solutions and doesn't adhear to the "You'll go where we want you to go"
principal. Also a company that cared enough about you as a customer to attempt
to obtain you as a customer. Not a company that calculates how many customers
they will lose when they make their next arbitrary change.

Dave
--
David Froble Tel: 724-529-0450
Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc. Fax: 724-529-0596
DFE Ultralights, Inc. E-Mail: ***@tsoft-inc.com
170 Grimplin Road
Vanderbilt, PA 15486
Bob Ceculski
2004-08-17 23:32:54 UTC
Permalink
Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy <***@nospamn.sun.com> wrote in message news:<cftc6o$7hm$***@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>...

remember, a box is only as good as the os that runs on it ...
OpenVMS complimented alpha and soon itanium ...
neither IBM or sun has any os to compliment their hardware ...
Fabio Cardoso
2004-08-18 11:26:27 UTC
Permalink
Post by Bob Ceculski
remember, a box is only as good as the os that runs on it ...
OpenVMS complimented alpha and soon itanium ...
neither IBM or sun has any os to compliment their hardware ...
I think Andrew knows that OpenVMS is a good product !
He is not in this news group wasting his time ! ;-)
But OVMS still expensive ! I think a good way to sell
OpenVMS systems (Itanium) is delivery it as an appliance
product - not exclusevily of course. For Telecom operators,
Financial, etc ... Put a lot of Oracle, BEA, Attunity inside
and sell the system(s) like a kit to power-and-run.
Like the NetApp OS. May be with the Itanium Blades we can
have a good surprise !


Regards

FC
Alex Daniels
2004-08-18 21:46:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by Fabio Cardoso
Post by Bob Ceculski
remember, a box is only as good as the os that runs on it ...
OpenVMS complimented alpha and soon itanium ...
neither IBM or sun has any os to compliment their hardware ...
I think Andrew knows that OpenVMS is a good product !
He is not in this news group wasting his time ! ;-)
But OVMS still expensive ! I think a good way to sell
OpenVMS systems (Itanium) is delivery it as an appliance
product - not exclusevily of course. For Telecom operators,
Financial, etc ... Put a lot of Oracle, BEA, Attunity inside
and sell the system(s) like a kit to power-and-run.
Like the NetApp OS. May be with the Itanium Blades we can
have a good surprise !
Regards
FC
Fabio,

Can you phone Servix in Brazil (they sell Itanium and Alphas) on 11 3619
3414 please? Get a quote for a rx1600, they are 1U high. I really would be
interested to know how much one would be from them, I want to understand the
scale of the high import charges you have previously mentioned.

Post back here the cost, go for an entry level config, 1 CPU and 1GB of RAM.

Thanks

Alex
Fabio Cardoso
2004-08-19 11:42:50 UTC
Permalink
Post by Alex Daniels
Post by Fabio Cardoso
Post by Bob Ceculski
remember, a box is only as good as the os that runs on it ...
OpenVMS complimented alpha and soon itanium ...
neither IBM or sun has any os to compliment their hardware ...
I think Andrew knows that OpenVMS is a good product !
He is not in this news group wasting his time ! ;-)
But OVMS still expensive ! I think a good way to sell
OpenVMS systems (Itanium) is delivery it as an appliance
product - not exclusevily of course. For Telecom operators,
Financial, etc ... Put a lot of Oracle, BEA, Attunity inside
and sell the system(s) like a kit to power-and-run.
Like the NetApp OS. May be with the Itanium Blades we can
have a good surprise !
Regards
FC
Fabio,
Can you phone Servix in Brazil (they sell Itanium and Alphas) on 11 3619
3414 please? Get a quote for a rx1600, they are 1U high. I really would be
interested to know how much one would be from them, I want to understand the
scale of the high import charges you have previously mentioned.
Post back here the cost, go for an entry level config, 1 CPU and 1GB of RAM.
Thanks
Alex
Ok Alex

Wait a few hours ! :-) By the way I know another reseller in
Brazil: www.decatron.com.br ! They are in Rio de Janeiro !
May I quote them ?

Regards

FC
Alex Daniels
2004-08-19 12:21:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by Fabio Cardoso
Post by Alex Daniels
Post by Fabio Cardoso
Post by Bob Ceculski
Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy
remember, a box is only as good as the os that runs on it ...
OpenVMS complimented alpha and soon itanium ...
neither IBM or sun has any os to compliment their hardware ...
I think Andrew knows that OpenVMS is a good product !
He is not in this news group wasting his time ! ;-)
But OVMS still expensive ! I think a good way to sell
OpenVMS systems (Itanium) is delivery it as an appliance
product - not exclusevily of course. For Telecom operators,
Financial, etc ... Put a lot of Oracle, BEA, Attunity inside
and sell the system(s) like a kit to power-and-run.
Like the NetApp OS. May be with the Itanium Blades we can
have a good surprise !
Regards
FC
Fabio,
Can you phone Servix in Brazil (they sell Itanium and Alphas) on 11 3619
3414 please? Get a quote for a rx1600, they are 1U high. I really would be
interested to know how much one would be from them, I want to understand the
scale of the high import charges you have previously mentioned.
Post back here the cost, go for an entry level config, 1 CPU and 1GB of RAM.
Thanks
Alex
Ok Alex
Wait a few hours ! :-) By the way I know another reseller in
Brazil: www.decatron.com.br ! They are in Rio de Janeiro !
May I quote them ?
Regards
FC
Fabio,

Yes why not get a quote from them too, I like their name with DEC in it,
although unlike Servix they are not mentioning VMS on their website (from
admittedly a quick look through).

Cheers

Alex
Fabio Cardoso
2004-08-20 11:46:56 UTC
Permalink
Post by Alex Daniels
Post by Fabio Cardoso
Post by Alex Daniels
Post by Fabio Cardoso
Post by Bob Ceculski
Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy
remember, a box is only as good as the os that runs on it ...
OpenVMS complimented alpha and soon itanium ...
neither IBM or sun has any os to compliment their hardware ...
I think Andrew knows that OpenVMS is a good product !
He is not in this news group wasting his time ! ;-)
But OVMS still expensive ! I think a good way to sell
OpenVMS systems (Itanium) is delivery it as an appliance
product - not exclusevily of course. For Telecom operators,
Financial, etc ... Put a lot of Oracle, BEA, Attunity inside
and sell the system(s) like a kit to power-and-run.
Like the NetApp OS. May be with the Itanium Blades we can
have a good surprise !
Regards
FC
Fabio,
Can you phone Servix in Brazil (they sell Itanium and Alphas) on 11 3619
3414 please? Get a quote for a rx1600, they are 1U high. I really would be
interested to know how much one would be from them, I want to understand the
scale of the high import charges you have previously mentioned.
Post back here the cost, go for an entry level config, 1 CPU and 1GB of RAM.
Thanks
Alex
Ok Alex
Wait a few hours ! :-) By the way I know another reseller in
Brazil: www.decatron.com.br ! They are in Rio de Janeiro !
May I quote them ?
Regards
FC
Fabio,
Yes why not get a quote from them too, I like their name with DEC in it,
although unlike Servix they are not mentioning VMS on their website (from
admittedly a quick look through).
Cheers
Alex
Alex

I receive one quote:

HP Integrity rx1600 with 1 CPU Itanium2 (1.1 GHz) , 1 GB of mem,
1 disk ( 36 GB 10K RPM) , Linux, 1 year of support Plus HP 24x7.

US$ 7.244,00

Obs: The 24x7 is mandatory !

Regards

FC
Fabio Cardoso
2004-08-23 17:21:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by Alex Daniels
Post by Fabio Cardoso
Post by Alex Daniels
Post by Fabio Cardoso
Post by Bob Ceculski
Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy
remember, a box is only as good as the os that runs on it ...
OpenVMS complimented alpha and soon itanium ...
neither IBM or sun has any os to compliment their hardware ...
I think Andrew knows that OpenVMS is a good product !
He is not in this news group wasting his time ! ;-)
But OVMS still expensive ! I think a good way to sell
OpenVMS systems (Itanium) is delivery it as an appliance
product - not exclusevily of course. For Telecom operators,
Financial, etc ... Put a lot of Oracle, BEA, Attunity inside
and sell the system(s) like a kit to power-and-run.
Like the NetApp OS. May be with the Itanium Blades we can
have a good surprise !
Regards
FC
Fabio,
Can you phone Servix in Brazil (they sell Itanium and Alphas) on 11 3619
3414 please? Get a quote for a rx1600, they are 1U high. I really would be
interested to know how much one would be from them, I want to understand the
scale of the high import charges you have previously mentioned.
Post back here the cost, go for an entry level config, 1 CPU and 1GB of RAM.
Thanks
Alex
Ok Alex
Wait a few hours ! :-) By the way I know another reseller in
Brazil: www.decatron.com.br ! They are in Rio de Janeiro !
May I quote them ?
Regards
FC
Fabio,
Yes why not get a quote from them too, I like their name with DEC in it,
although unlike Servix they are not mentioning VMS on their website (from
admittedly a quick look through).
Cheers
Alex
Alex ! Are u there ?

RX1600 ! US$ 6.733,00

"Rubem Dickie" <***@servix.com>


Regards

FC
Alex Daniels
2004-08-27 10:04:05 UTC
Permalink
<SNIP>
Post by Fabio Cardoso
Post by Alex Daniels
Post by Fabio Cardoso
Post by Alex Daniels
Post by Fabio Cardoso
May be with the Itanium Blades we can
have a good surprise !
Regards
FC
Fabio,
Can you phone Servix in Brazil (they sell Itanium and Alphas) on 11 3619
3414 please? Get a quote for a rx1600, they are 1U high. I really
would
be
interested to know how much one would be from them, I want to
understand
the
scale of the high import charges you have previously mentioned.
Post back here the cost, go for an entry level config, 1 CPU and 1GB
of
RAM.
Thanks
Alex
Ok Alex
Wait a few hours ! :-) By the way I know another reseller in
Brazil: www.decatron.com.br ! They are in Rio de Janeiro !
May I quote them ?
Regards
FC
Fabio,
Yes why not get a quote from them too, I like their name with DEC in it,
although unlike Servix they are not mentioning VMS on their website (from
admittedly a quick look through).
Cheers
Alex
HP Integrity rx1600 with 1 CPU Itanium2 (1.1 GHz) , 1 GB of mem,
1 disk ( 36 GB 10K RPM) , Linux, 1 year of support Plus HP 24x7.
US$ 7.244,00
Obs: The 24x7 is mandatory !
Alex ! Are u there ?
RX1600 ! US$ 6.733,00
Sorry for the delay. I just priced up a similar config on the HP website (
http://h71016.www7.hp.com/dstore/ctoBases.asp?oi=E9CED&BEID=19701&SBLID=amp;&ProductLineId=431&FamilyId=1784&LowBaseId=&LowPrice=&jumpid=re_hphqwwservers_IntBuy/rx1600/HomeBuyBtn )

I priced a 1Mhz CPU though not 1.1Mhz, 1GB mem, 1 36GIG Disk, 1 management
processor and 1yr 24x7 linux support.

Came out at USD $5200, the linux support was a notable amount of this.

So looks like the difference between the US and Brazil is around $1500,
doesn't seem the 'high import charges in Brazil' are quite as bad as you
have made out!!

Is the lower of the quotes you got, for what is a pretty nice spec for an
entry level machine, really so much for companies there?

Cheers

Alex
Andrew Harrison
2004-08-27 12:57:46 UTC
Permalink
Post by Alex Daniels
<SNIP>
Post by Fabio Cardoso
Post by Alex Daniels
Post by Fabio Cardoso
Post by Alex Daniels
Post by Fabio Cardoso
May be with the Itanium Blades we can
have a good surprise !
Regards
FC
Fabio,
Can you phone Servix in Brazil (they sell Itanium and Alphas) on 11 3619
3414 please? Get a quote for a rx1600, they are 1U high. I really
would
be
interested to know how much one would be from them, I want to
understand
the
scale of the high import charges you have previously mentioned.
Post back here the cost, go for an entry level config, 1 CPU and 1GB
of
RAM.
Thanks
Alex
Ok Alex
Wait a few hours ! :-) By the way I know another reseller in
Brazil: www.decatron.com.br ! They are in Rio de Janeiro !
May I quote them ?
Regards
FC
Fabio,
Yes why not get a quote from them too, I like their name with DEC in it,
although unlike Servix they are not mentioning VMS on their website (from
admittedly a quick look through).
Cheers
Alex
HP Integrity rx1600 with 1 CPU Itanium2 (1.1 GHz) , 1 GB of mem,
1 disk ( 36 GB 10K RPM) , Linux, 1 year of support Plus HP 24x7.
US$ 7.244,00
Obs: The 24x7 is mandatory !
Alex ! Are u there ?
RX1600 ! US$ 6.733,00
Sorry for the delay. I just priced up a similar config on the HP website (
http://h71016.www7.hp.com/dstore/ctoBases.asp?oi=E9CED&BEID=19701&SBLID=amp;&ProductLineId=431&FamilyId=1784&LowBaseId=&LowPrice=&jumpid=re_hphqwwservers_IntBuy/rx1600/HomeBuyBtn )
I priced a 1Mhz CPU though not 1.1Mhz, 1GB mem, 1 36GIG Disk, 1 management
processor and 1yr 24x7 linux support.
I think you mean GHz.
Post by Alex Daniels
Came out at USD $5200, the linux support was a notable amount of this.
So looks like the difference between the US and Brazil is around $1500,
doesn't seem the 'high import charges in Brazil' are quite as bad as you
have made out!!
Is the lower of the quotes you got, for what is a pretty nice spec for an
entry level machine, really so much for companies there?
Seems horribly expensive compared with what you could get
for $52000 elsewhere particularly if it is only a 1 MHz
unit :-)

Regards
Andrew Harrison
Post by Alex Daniels
Cheers
Alex
Fabio Cardoso
2004-08-27 13:40:51 UTC
Permalink
Post by Alex Daniels
<SNIP>
Post by Fabio Cardoso
Post by Alex Daniels
Post by Fabio Cardoso
Post by Alex Daniels
Post by Fabio Cardoso
May be with the Itanium Blades we can
have a good surprise !
Regards
FC
Fabio,
Can you phone Servix in Brazil (they sell Itanium and Alphas) on 11 3619
3414 please? Get a quote for a rx1600, they are 1U high. I really
would
be
interested to know how much one would be from them, I want to
understand
the
scale of the high import charges you have previously mentioned.
Post back here the cost, go for an entry level config, 1 CPU and 1GB
of
RAM.
Thanks
Alex
Ok Alex
Wait a few hours ! :-) By the way I know another reseller in
Brazil: www.decatron.com.br ! They are in Rio de Janeiro !
May I quote them ?
Regards
FC
Fabio,
Yes why not get a quote from them too, I like their name with DEC in it,
although unlike Servix they are not mentioning VMS on their website (from
admittedly a quick look through).
Cheers
Alex
HP Integrity rx1600 with 1 CPU Itanium2 (1.1 GHz) , 1 GB of mem,
1 disk ( 36 GB 10K RPM) , Linux, 1 year of support Plus HP 24x7.
US$ 7.244,00
Obs: The 24x7 is mandatory !
Alex ! Are u there ?
RX1600 ! US$ 6.733,00
Sorry for the delay. I just priced up a similar config on the HP website (
http://h71016.www7.hp.com/dstore/ctoBases.asp?oi=E9CED&BEID=19701&SBLID=amp;&ProductLineId=431&FamilyId=1784&LowBaseId=&LowPrice=&jumpid=re_hphqwwservers_IntBuy/rx1600/HomeBuyBtn )
I priced a 1Mhz CPU though not 1.1Mhz, 1GB mem, 1 36GIG Disk, 1 management
processor and 1yr 24x7 linux support.
Came out at USD $5200, the linux support was a notable amount of this.
So looks like the difference between the US and Brazil is around $1500,
doesn't seem the 'high import charges in Brazil' are quite as bad as you
have made out!!
Is the lower of the quotes you got, for what is a pretty nice spec for an
entry level machine, really so much for companies there?
Cheers
Alex
Alex.

This is the lower price I quoted. But .. in the link above the
system have 2 CPUs and I quoted 1 CPU + 1 GB only !
Is the USA price right for this system ?

Regards

FC
Alex Daniels
2004-08-27 19:30:18 UTC
Permalink
Post by Fabio Cardoso
Post by Alex Daniels
<SNIP>
Post by Fabio Cardoso
Post by Alex Daniels
Post by Fabio Cardoso
Post by Alex Daniels
Post by Fabio Cardoso
May be with the Itanium Blades we can
have a good surprise !
Regards
FC
Fabio,
Can you phone Servix in Brazil (they sell Itanium and Alphas) on 11 3619
3414 please? Get a quote for a rx1600, they are 1U high. I really
would
be
interested to know how much one would be from them, I want to
understand
the
scale of the high import charges you have previously mentioned.
Post back here the cost, go for an entry level config, 1 CPU and 1GB
of
RAM.
Thanks
Alex
Ok Alex
Wait a few hours ! :-) By the way I know another reseller in
Brazil: www.decatron.com.br ! They are in Rio de Janeiro !
May I quote them ?
Regards
FC
Fabio,
Yes why not get a quote from them too, I like their name with DEC in it,
although unlike Servix they are not mentioning VMS on their website (from
admittedly a quick look through).
Cheers
Alex
HP Integrity rx1600 with 1 CPU Itanium2 (1.1 GHz) , 1 GB of mem,
1 disk ( 36 GB 10K RPM) , Linux, 1 year of support Plus HP 24x7.
US$ 7.244,00
Obs: The 24x7 is mandatory !
Alex ! Are u there ?
RX1600 ! US$ 6.733,00
Sorry for the delay. I just priced up a similar config on the HP website (
http://h71016.www7.hp.com/dstore/ctoBases.asp?oi=E9CED&BEID=19701&SBLID=amp;&ProductLineId=431&FamilyId=1784&LowBaseId=&LowPrice=&jumpid=re_hphqwwservers_IntBuy/rx1600/HomeBuyBtn )
I priced a 1Mhz CPU though not 1.1Mhz, 1GB mem, 1 36GIG Disk, 1 management
processor and 1yr 24x7 linux support.
Came out at USD $5200, the linux support was a notable amount of this.
So looks like the difference between the US and Brazil is around $1500,
doesn't seem the 'high import charges in Brazil' are quite as bad as you
have made out!!
Is the lower of the quotes you got, for what is a pretty nice spec for an
entry level machine, really so much for companies there?
Cheers
Alex
Alex.
This is the lower price I quoted. But .. in the link above the
system have 2 CPUs and I quoted 1 CPU + 1 GB only !
Is the USA price right for this system ?
Regards
FC
Fabio,

The US price is correct, as of earlier today, its came directly from
following links off the page I posted. In the examples on that first page,
they are single CPU not dual, the -2 in rx1600-2 I believe is indicating it
has an Itanium 2 in it, not that it has 2 CPUs.

As you can see, you can get one for as low as $2110, but the price I gave
was the more or less the same spec as you gave, with the 24x7 linux support.

Andrew,
Post by Fabio Cardoso
Seems horribly expensive compared with what you could get
for $52000 elsewhere particularly if it is only a 1 MHz
unit :-)
Well for $52k I would want more than 1Mhz, :-)

Alex
Robert Deininger
2004-08-28 12:47:30 UTC
Permalink
In article <412f8bcf$0$6171$***@news.zen.co.uk>, "Alex Daniels"
<***@themail.co.uk> wrote:

...
Post by Alex Daniels
Fabio,
The US price is correct, as of earlier today, its came directly from
following links off the page I posted. In the examples on that first page,
they are single CPU not dual, the -2 in rx1600-2 I believe is indicating it
has an Itanium 2 in it, not that it has 2 CPUs.
The "-2" in the name means it can hold UP TO 2 CPUs. You can buy it with
1 or 2. The rx2600 is also a "-2", and the rx4640 is a "-8".

AFAIK, the only CPU available for the rx1600-2 is 1 GHz. I've not heard
of a 1.1 GHz flavor.
Post by Alex Daniels
As you can see, you can get one for as low as $2110, but the price I gave
was the more or less the same spec as you gave, with the 24x7 linux support.
The rx1600-2 happily runs VMS 8.2 FT (though support won't be official
until the real V8.2 release ships), so this is likely the lowest entry
price for a VMS system in the history of VMS.

Compare the price to an Alphaserver DS15. You'll never get the
configurations to match exactly, but if you just want a cheap system to
run VMS, the rx1600 is probably the winner for most folks.

-- Robert
Fabio Cardoso
2004-08-30 17:23:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by Robert Deininger
...
Post by Alex Daniels
Fabio,
The US price is correct, as of earlier today, its came directly from
following links off the page I posted. In the examples on that first page,
they are single CPU not dual, the -2 in rx1600-2 I believe is indicating it
has an Itanium 2 in it, not that it has 2 CPUs.
The "-2" in the name means it can hold UP TO 2 CPUs. You can buy it with
1 or 2. The rx2600 is also a "-2", and the rx4640 is a "-8".
AFAIK, the only CPU available for the rx1600-2 is 1 GHz. I've not heard
of a 1.1 GHz flavor.
Post by Alex Daniels
As you can see, you can get one for as low as $2110, but the price I gave
was the more or less the same spec as you gave, with the 24x7 linux support.
The rx1600-2 happily runs VMS 8.2 FT (though support won't be official
until the real V8.2 release ships), so this is likely the lowest entry
price for a VMS system in the history of VMS.
Compare the price to an Alphaserver DS15. You'll never get the
configurations to match exactly, but if you just want a cheap system to
run VMS, the rx1600 is probably the winner for most folks.
-- Robert
Yes ! But ... read the Processor columns !

The RX1600 qith one processor costs US$ 2800 and with two
processors US$ 5600,00 (+/-). Am I blind ?

Regards

FC
Alex Daniels
2004-08-30 19:10:41 UTC
Permalink
"Fabio Cardoso" <***@yahoo.com.br> wrote in message news:***@posting.google.com...
<SNIP>
Post by Fabio Cardoso
Yes ! But ... read the Processor columns !
The RX1600 qith one processor costs US$ 2800 and with two
processors US$ 5600,00 (+/-). Am I blind ?
Fabio,

I said...
Post by Fabio Cardoso
Post by Alex Daniels
I priced a 1Mhz CPU though not 1.1Mhz, 1GB mem, 1 36GIG Disk, 1 management
processor and 1yr 24x7 linux support.
Came out at USD $5200, the linux support was a notable amount of this
Note the $5200 NOT $5600, that was from specific options I selected (as
above) on the configurable options page ( follow the links on the page to
get there), and a notable part of that was the 24X7 linux support.

Thus my point remains..
Post by Fabio Cardoso
Post by Alex Daniels
So looks like the difference between the US and Brazil is around $1500,
doesn't seem the 'high import charges in Brazil' are quite as bad as you
have made out!!
Is the lower of the quotes you got, for what is a pretty nice spec for an
entry level machine, really so much for companies there?
Maybe you should insist you want it without the 24X7 linux support, the
resellers have to chose a 'support' option, but there is a part number for
'no support'.

Get them to change the 24X7 linux support, (probably part number HA111A1 or
HA110A1) to 'No Additional Support Purchased" this is part number H4396A.

Yes its odd to have a part number to order 'no support', but I guess its to
ensure the question has been asked. I am sure with this your price will come
out a lot better!

Alex
Fabio Cardoso
2004-08-31 11:54:44 UTC
Permalink
(...)
Post by Alex Daniels
Maybe you should insist you want it without the 24X7 linux support, the
resellers have to chose a 'support' option, but there is a part number for
'no support'.
Get them to change the 24X7 linux support, (probably part number HA111A1 or
HA110A1) to 'No Additional Support Purchased" this is part number H4396A.
Yes its odd to have a part number to order 'no support', but I guess its to
ensure the question has been asked. I am sure with this your price will come
out a lot better!
Alex
Alex

I doubt ! The reseller told me that the 24x7 support is mandatory.
Why ? Well I don´t believe Linux as a "free" product.
The companies dont want to make investments in operating systems
anymore, but they want to make money with support (mandatory) and
services.

Regards

FC
Bill Gunshannon
2004-08-31 13:07:26 UTC
Permalink
Post by Fabio Cardoso
(...)
Post by Alex Daniels
Maybe you should insist you want it without the 24X7 linux support, the
resellers have to chose a 'support' option, but there is a part number for
'no support'.
Get them to change the 24X7 linux support, (probably part number HA111A1 or
HA110A1) to 'No Additional Support Purchased" this is part number H4396A.
Yes its odd to have a part number to order 'no support', but I guess its to
ensure the question has been asked. I am sure with this your price will come
out a lot better!
Alex
Alex
I doubt ! The reseller told me that the 24x7 support is mandatory.
Why ? Well I don´t believe Linux as a "free" product.
The companies dont want to make investments in operating systems
anymore, but they want to make money with support (mandatory) and
services.
The flaw in the Gnu Public Virus. Lot's of people appear to live
up to the letter of the agreement while blatantly violating the
spirit.

bill
--
Bill Gunshannon | de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n. Three wolves
***@cs.scranton.edu | and a sheep voting on what's for dinner.
University of Scranton |
Scranton, Pennsylvania | #include <std.disclaimer.h>
Alex Daniels
2004-08-30 19:10:41 UTC
Permalink
"Fabio Cardoso" <***@yahoo.com.br> wrote in message news:***@posting.google.com...
<SNIP>
Post by Fabio Cardoso
Yes ! But ... read the Processor columns !
The RX1600 qith one processor costs US$ 2800 and with two
processors US$ 5600,00 (+/-). Am I blind ?
Fabio,

I said...
Post by Fabio Cardoso
Post by Alex Daniels
I priced a 1Mhz CPU though not 1.1Mhz, 1GB mem, 1 36GIG Disk, 1 management
processor and 1yr 24x7 linux support.
Came out at USD $5200, the linux support was a notable amount of this
Note the $5200 NOT $5600, that was from specific options I selected (as
above) on the configurable options page ( follow the links on the page to
get there), and a notable part of that was the 24X7 linux support.

Thus my point remains..
Post by Fabio Cardoso
Post by Alex Daniels
So looks like the difference between the US and Brazil is around $1500,
doesn't seem the 'high import charges in Brazil' are quite as bad as you
have made out!!
Is the lower of the quotes you got, for what is a pretty nice spec for an
entry level machine, really so much for companies there?
Maybe you should insist you want it without the 24X7 linux support, the
resellers have to chose a 'support' option, but there is a part number for
'no support'.

Get them to change the 24X7 linux support, (probably part number HA111A1 or
HA110A1) to 'No Additional Support Purchased" this is part number H4396A.

Yes its odd to have a part number to order 'no support', but I guess its to
ensure the question has been asked. I am sure with this your price will come
out a lot better!

Alex
Bob Ceculski
2004-08-17 23:33:02 UTC
Permalink
Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy <***@nospamn.sun.com> wrote in message news:<cftc6o$7hm$***@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>...

remember, a box is only as good as the os that runs on it ...
OpenVMS complimented alpha and soon itanium ...
neither IBM or sun has any os to compliment their hardware ...
Bob Ceculski
2004-08-17 23:33:08 UTC
Permalink
Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy <***@nospamn.sun.com> wrote in message news:<cftc6o$7hm$***@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>...

remember, a box is only as good as the os that runs on it ...
OpenVMS complimented alpha and soon itanium ...
neither IBM or sun has any os to compliment their hardware ...
John Smith
2004-08-20 13:57:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by Fabio Cardoso
Click
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/08/17/sun_hpaway_phasethree/
HP's Unix base offered Opteron carrot
"HP World Sun Microsystems has started Phase III of its HP Away
program for shifting customers off the Tru64 and HP-UX operating
systems and onto Solaris.
This time round Sun has centered its attack on a new fleet of Opteron
servers, which were finally delivered in July, instead of its
traditional UltraSPARC-based gear. As in the past, Sun offers up free
consulting services to HP customers to demonstrate how much a move
from Tru64 or HP-UX will cost and how well applications will perform
on Solaris. Over the past year, Sun has pulled 150 customers from HP,
resulting in close to $200m in revenue.
"We were focused on moving customers from RISC to RISC before, but now
that we have these Opteron systems, we decided to offer a move from HP
RISC platforms to x86 as well," said Larry Singer, Sun's head of
global market strategies.
One positive with the new Opteron program is that HP customers are
being given a path from traditionally more expensive Alpha- and
PA-RISC-based servers to lower-cost x86 gear.
^
Post by Fabio Cardoso
------- HP: Look at this paragraph !!!
Sun offers workstations, a two processor box and a four processor box
based on AMD's x86-64-bit Opteron chip. Sun is familiar with this
shift from RISC to x86, as it has seen a number of its key customers,
particularly those in the financial services markets, move from
Solaris/SPARC kit to Linux on Intel.
These days, however, Sun's renewed interest in Solaris x86 has it
asking HP's customer base to make an easier Unix to Unix shift and
just replace the processor underneath the OS. But with only up to a
four-processor Opteron system available, Sun won't be able to tempt
HP's higher-end Unix customers to make this move. In addition, Sun has
yet to complete a 64-bit version of Solaris for Opteron. HP customers
would need to be running 32-bit software or wait until December to get
the 64-bit OS.
Sun, of course, started this HP Away program to attract Alpha and
PA-RISC customers that are being forced to move onto Intel's 64-bit
Itanium processor, as HP pulls out of the processor-making game.
(...)"
So HP has their own 'Total Eclipse' program to woo Sun whoreshipers away to
HP.

From http://www.shannonknowshpc.com/archives/SKHPCV11N33.pdf

"Sun worshippers who want to reduce their IT TCO, exploit the lower cost and
higher performance of industry standard systems, enjoy the freedom of open
source computing, become more agile and adaptive, and take the next
evolutionary step in the datacenter may find that HP and Intel outshine Sun.
The Total Eclipse program offers Sun to HP migration assistance services
with a proof of concept offer valued at up to $50K USD as well as system
trade in choices to HP industry standard hardware and Linux, Windows, and
HP-UX OS choices. The offer includes the use of a proof of concept system
for the duration of the project at no charge to you."

If Sr. Shannon's article is correct, I note the conspicuous absence of
OpenVMS in the offer.

Seems to me that HP is offering Solaris users to trade from one sow's ear to
another, or worse. How is that beneficial to the user?
David Froble
2004-08-20 17:59:24 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Smith
Post by Fabio Cardoso
Click
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/08/17/sun_hpaway_phasethree/
HP's Unix base offered Opteron carrot
"HP World Sun Microsystems has started Phase III of its HP Away
program for shifting customers off the Tru64 and HP-UX operating
systems and onto Solaris.
This time round Sun has centered its attack on a new fleet of Opteron
servers, which were finally delivered in July, instead of its
traditional UltraSPARC-based gear. As in the past, Sun offers up free
consulting services to HP customers to demonstrate how much a move
from Tru64 or HP-UX will cost and how well applications will perform
on Solaris. Over the past year, Sun has pulled 150 customers from HP,
resulting in close to $200m in revenue.
"We were focused on moving customers from RISC to RISC before, but now
that we have these Opteron systems, we decided to offer a move from HP
RISC platforms to x86 as well," said Larry Singer, Sun's head of
global market strategies.
One positive with the new Opteron program is that HP customers are
being given a path from traditionally more expensive Alpha- and
PA-RISC-based servers to lower-cost x86 gear.
^
Post by Fabio Cardoso
------- HP: Look at this paragraph !!!
Sun offers workstations, a two processor box and a four processor box
based on AMD's x86-64-bit Opteron chip. Sun is familiar with this
shift from RISC to x86, as it has seen a number of its key customers,
particularly those in the financial services markets, move from
Solaris/SPARC kit to Linux on Intel.
These days, however, Sun's renewed interest in Solaris x86 has it
asking HP's customer base to make an easier Unix to Unix shift and
just replace the processor underneath the OS. But with only up to a
four-processor Opteron system available, Sun won't be able to tempt
HP's higher-end Unix customers to make this move. In addition, Sun has
yet to complete a 64-bit version of Solaris for Opteron. HP customers
would need to be running 32-bit software or wait until December to get
the 64-bit OS.
Sun, of course, started this HP Away program to attract Alpha and
PA-RISC customers that are being forced to move onto Intel's 64-bit
Itanium processor, as HP pulls out of the processor-making game.
(...)"
So HP has their own 'Total Eclipse' program to woo Sun whoreshipers away to
HP.
From http://www.shannonknowshpc.com/archives/SKHPCV11N33.pdf
"Sun worshippers who want to reduce their IT TCO, exploit the lower cost and
higher performance of industry standard systems, enjoy the freedom of open
source computing, become more agile and adaptive, and take the next
evolutionary step in the datacenter may find that HP and Intel outshine Sun.
The Total Eclipse program offers Sun to HP migration assistance services
with a proof of concept offer valued at up to $50K USD as well as system
trade in choices to HP industry standard hardware and Linux, Windows, and
HP-UX OS choices. The offer includes the use of a proof of concept system
for the duration of the project at no charge to you."
If Sr. Shannon's article is correct, I note the conspicuous absence of
OpenVMS in the offer.
Seems to me that HP is offering Solaris users to trade from one sow's ear to
another, or worse. How is that beneficial to the user?
Agreed. I was going to point out that they are talking Unix to Unix/Linux, but
it seems that HP just cannot say one sentence without uttering the word
'windows'. With that in there, the ommission of VMS becomes significant.

Dave
--
David Froble Tel: 724-529-0450
Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc. Fax: 724-529-0596
DFE Ultralights, Inc. E-Mail: ***@tsoft-inc.com
170 Grimplin Road
Vanderbilt, PA 15486
John Smith
2004-08-23 18:50:05 UTC
Permalink
Post by David Froble
Post by John Smith
Post by Fabio Cardoso
Click
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/08/17/sun_hpaway_phasethree/
HP's Unix base offered Opteron carrot
"HP World Sun Microsystems has started Phase III of its HP Away
program for shifting customers off the Tru64 and HP-UX operating
systems and onto Solaris.
This time round Sun has centered its attack on a new fleet of
Opteron servers, which were finally delivered in July, instead of
its traditional UltraSPARC-based gear. As in the past, Sun offers
up free consulting services to HP customers to demonstrate how much
a move from Tru64 or HP-UX will cost and how well applications will
perform on Solaris. Over the past year, Sun has pulled 150
customers from HP, resulting in close to $200m in revenue.
"We were focused on moving customers from RISC to RISC before, but
now that we have these Opteron systems, we decided to offer a move
from HP RISC platforms to x86 as well," said Larry Singer, Sun's
head of global market strategies.
One positive with the new Opteron program is that HP customers are
being given a path from traditionally more expensive Alpha- and
PA-RISC-based servers to lower-cost x86 gear.
^
Post by Fabio Cardoso
------- HP: Look at this paragraph !!!
Sun offers workstations, a two processor box and a four processor
box based on AMD's x86-64-bit Opteron chip. Sun is familiar with
this shift from RISC to x86, as it has seen a number of its key
customers, particularly those in the financial services markets,
move from Solaris/SPARC kit to Linux on Intel.
These days, however, Sun's renewed interest in Solaris x86 has it
asking HP's customer base to make an easier Unix to Unix shift and
just replace the processor underneath the OS. But with only up to a
four-processor Opteron system available, Sun won't be able to tempt
HP's higher-end Unix customers to make this move. In addition, Sun
has yet to complete a 64-bit version of Solaris for Opteron. HP
customers would need to be running 32-bit software or wait until
December to get the 64-bit OS.
Sun, of course, started this HP Away program to attract Alpha and
PA-RISC customers that are being forced to move onto Intel's 64-bit
Itanium processor, as HP pulls out of the processor-making game.
(...)"
So HP has their own 'Total Eclipse' program to woo Sun whoreshipers
away to HP.
From http://www.shannonknowshpc.com/archives/SKHPCV11N33.pdf
"Sun worshippers who want to reduce their IT TCO, exploit the lower
cost and higher performance of industry standard systems, enjoy the
freedom of open source computing, become more agile and adaptive,
and take the next evolutionary step in the datacenter may find that
HP and Intel outshine Sun. The Total Eclipse program offers Sun to
HP migration assistance services with a proof of concept offer
valued at up to $50K USD as well as system trade in choices to HP
industry standard hardware and Linux, Windows, and HP-UX OS choices.
The offer includes the use of a proof of concept system for the
duration of the project at no charge to you."
If Sr. Shannon's article is correct, I note the conspicuous absence
of OpenVMS in the offer.
Seems to me that HP is offering Solaris users to trade from one
sow's ear to another, or worse. How is that beneficial to the user?
Agreed. I was going to point out that they are talking Unix to
Unix/Linux, but it seems that HP just cannot say one sentence without
uttering the word 'windows'. With that in there, the ommission of
VMS becomes significant.
"....
Sun Microsystems has undertaken a campaign called HPAway to lure AlphaServer
Tru64 Unix customers to its AMD Opteron workstations and servers. Sun has
boasted that 150 customers have migrated so far. Shannon, however, said the
overwhelming majority of Alpha users are moving to HP Itanium computers.
"You've got more than 700,000 Alphas out there and a quarter of million
users, and Sun is bragging about 150 users?" asked Shannon rhetorically.
"That's nothing." "



http://www.techweb.com/wire/story/TWB20040820S0005

Of course it's nothing....Sun's campaign is just getting started. Wait til
it's been going a while.

Sun has better prospects at bringing VMS customer to Solaris than HP has of
bringing Solaris users to PH-UX.

HP ought to be advertising VMS....but we all know what they are going to do.
JF Mezei
2004-08-23 19:45:06 UTC
Permalink
Post by John Smith
boasted that 150 customers have migrated so far. Shannon, however, said the
overwhelming majority of Alpha users are moving to HP Itanium computers.
"You've got more than 700,000 Alphas out there and a quarter of million
users, and Sun is bragging about 150 users?" asked Shannon rhetorically.
"That's nothing." "
There may be 700,000 Alphas out there, but how many customers ? IF you have
customers with 1,000 alphas, and Sun has targetted those customers, then 150
customers represents 150,000 alphas being replaced by Suns. Not a figure to ignore.
Tom Wade
2004-08-23 13:51:03 UTC
Permalink
Post by Fabio Cardoso
"HP World Sun Microsystems has started Phase III of its HP Away
program for shifting customers off the Tru64 and HP-UX operating
systems and onto Solaris.
May I respectfully suggest that this forum (comp.os.VMS) is not appropriate
for posting HP releases that have nothing to do with OpenVMS.

Tom Wade
JF Mezei
2004-08-23 17:24:45 UTC
Permalink
Post by Tom Wade
May I respectfully suggest that this forum (comp.os.VMS) is not appropriate
for posting HP releases that have nothing to do with OpenVMS.
Perhaps on the surface. However, when competitors are targetting customers
running on EOLed products such as Alpha, then it does concern VMS.

When you are forced to make a transition to a different platform and retest,
recertify your software, or deal with vendor who may or may not be
retargetting their software to IA64, then if the competition becomes quite
agressive, your management may have no choice but to take the sweet offers to
convert once and for all to a new platform.

While HP's fud about the end of SPARC being near does make one wonder about
moving to SPARC today, I am not sure that this is sufficient to prevent
conversion today since SPARC will continue to be developped for at least 5 years.

Furthermore, if you move to SPARC-Solaris today with a potential for a
8086-Solaris conversion later, you know that Solaris on the 64 bit 8086 will
be available.

But if you move to VMS-IA64 this year, and IA64 is phased out, it isn't a
given that HP will migrate VMS to the 64 bit 8086 since it is not part of its
core business and HP doesn't depend on VMS to survive as does Sun depen on
Solaris to survive.
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